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Clever

25 Sep 2007 08:45 am

I see David Brooks has decided to celebrate his liberation from TimesSelect by penning a column seemingly designed to get tons of liberal bloggers to link to him by pissing us off. So, mission accomplished. Almost everything Brooks says is true (though more on this later), but this is very misleading:

Third, Clinton has established this lead by repudiating the netroots theory of politics. As the journalist Matt Bai makes clear in his superb book, “The Argument,” the netroots emerged in part in rebellion against Clintonian politics. They wanted bold colors and slashing attacks. They didn’t want their politicians catering to what Markos Moulitsas Zúniga of the Daily Kos calls “the mythical middle.”

But Clinton has relied on Mark Penn, the epitome of the sort of consultant the netroots reject, and Penn’s approach has been entirely vindicated by the results so far.

Now that's just wrong. Clinton may or may not implement a Penn-style strategy of triangulation if she becomes the nominee, but neither she nor Penn are nearly dumb enough to be trying this in the primary. Rather, Clinton is garnering high-levels of support from less-educated Democrats (as Brooks notes) through a campaign heavily focused on the theme of partisanship -- on her years of cut-throat battles with the right, on the idea that the Clintons know how to kick GOP ass, and implicitly on the notion that there aren't big ideological differences between the different Democrats in the race.

The bigger problem with Brooks' column, though, isn't so much that it says things that are wrong as that it leaves things out. He says Clinton is "hawkish" compared to what the netroots want to see and that "Democratic domestic policy is now being driven by old Clinton hands like Gene Sperling and Bruce Reed." Both are true, but it's still also true that all of the Democrats are calling for substantial reductions of troop levels in Iraq, which none of the candidates (including Howard Dean) were doing in 2004. They're all calling for diplomatic talks with Syria and Iran. They're also all calling for universal health care, which John Kerry didn't do, Al Gore didn't do, and Bill Clinton didn't do in 1996. And they all support serious reductions in CO2 emissions, which, again, neither Kerry nor Gore nor Clinton did.

And that, generally, is the shape of things. "The left" has only been empowered to a pretty minor degree, but the "centrist" wing of the party is . . . way further left on the merits than where it was in the late 1990s or the early years of the twentieth century. That, in turn, is largely a reflection of a renewed vibrancy on the left that's both pressured elected officials and expanded the boundaries of conversation. When the centrist strand in Democratic thinking came to represent school uniforms, promises to balance the budget each and every year of the Gore administration, and backing the invasion of Iraq that was one thing. If, instead, we're going to get universal health care, action to halt global warming, and diplomatic engagement with rival powers in the Middle East, that's a very different thing. If Brooks wants to call that latter thing a defeat for the netroots because dKos diarists sometimes find themselves disappointed, well, then I think that's a kind of defeat people can live with.

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Comments (28)

If Brooks wants to call that latter thing a defeat for the netroots because dKos diarists sometimes find themselves disappointed, well, then I think that's a kind of defeat people can live with.

There's little doubt the Netroots have pushed the Democratic Party and its Presidential candidates well to the left. There's also little doubt they did so against the wise counsel of David Brooks and other "conservatives" of his ilk.

After the Democrats reclaim the White House, hold the Senate, and hold the House, David Brooks will be welcome to pen another smarmy column putting down bloggers and praising Mark Penn. He'll do so in an environment much more comfortable for the Netroots than for himself.

You're absolutely correct. I'll be able to live with that situation just fine.
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For a very smart guy, Brooks is quite capable of writing some very silly things.

That being said, health care, global warming, and diplomacy in the ME are becoming much more central issues. This is certainly a change from the last cycle, I agree. But can the netroots take credit for that? I'm not sure.

"But Clinton has relied on Mark Penn, the epitome of the sort of consultant the netroots reject, and Penn’s approach has been entirely vindicated by the results so far."

It was very clever of Penn to travel back in time and convince Hillary not to divorce Bill.

If Universal Healthcare, serious CO2 cuts and withdrawing from Iraq are centrist, then I am centrist.

How quickly would Hillary Clinton end the Iraq War? My intuition tells me that there will be at least 50,000 soldiers in Iraq in 2012. That's a split the baby, hawkish policy to me.

I guess it's one thing to make sure one doesn't "rest on one's laurels," but why does it seem like so many of the dailykos denizens still can't "live with" what the candidates are proposing? Sometimes I think some of those people are not just idealists or perfectionists, but just plain vindictive...

I guess it's one thing to make sure one doesn't "rest on one's laurels," but why does it seem like so many of the dailykos denizens still can't "live with" what the candidates are proposing? Sometimes I think some of those people are not just idealists or perfectionists, but just plain vindictive...


Can you cite one example?

I guess I largely agree with this post, but I don't think Brooks's comments are the sorts of things that can be wrong. He's injecting himself into the conversation between Democrats and offering a settlement position with neocon Republicans (and, by implication, associated Dems). His positions are attractive because many Dems--I think on the strength of a series of small cultural similarities and his general likeability--continue to believe that he's some sort of bleeding edge Republican who sits at the boundary between Democrats and Republicans. (He's really not. "National Greatness" is kind of crazy and creepy.) You can accept his offer or refuse it, but it's not really "wrong."

Both Matt and David are ignoring the big elephant in the room, namely that Clinton is perceived much more liberal than she is, especially with regards to foreign policy.

One can see as well that the Republican party has moved to the right-- Remember 'compassionate conservatism'? We don't hear anything like that from any of the Republican candidates. This presents a problem for Brooks because he wants-- very, very badly-- to be seen as a centrist (although he is, in fact, quite the winger). But the center of American politics has moved leftwards-- and Brooks is consequently stuck with the lunatics, the dead-enders, and the lingering odor of manly aftershave.

The single biggest problem I have with today's Brooks' absurdist column is his diss of the effectiveness of the netroots in advancing their candidates. Last year the Penn-style establishment Senate candidates in Montana and Virginia lost their primaries to the netroots' underdogs, who, in spite of the cries of lamentation from the banks of the Potomac, went on to win their general elections and flip control of the Senate to the Democrats. You could certainly argue that some of Webb's and Tester's votes are disappointing to the netroots but you can't diminsh the value of the netroots' contribution to the '06 elections. Indeed, Chuck Schumer, head of the DSCC, went on to laud the netroots for their central role in handing the keys to Congress back to the Dems.

Brooks conveniently omits the results from last year's election from today's column. Who's editing him at the Times, anyway?

ProfD:

But can the netroots take credit for that? I'm not sure.

Oh cmon, don't be a wimp. :-) I'm sure they can't. This "they're been pulled further left" by the netroots stuff is ridiculous. Hillary and Obama seem to basically be running with an eye on getting disgruntled Bush voters. Edwards is the only frontrunner that could even be said to be running against DLC principles.

It's because of the health care situation people have had to deal with every day that makes it a good time to go there, it's coming to a critical mass. (Just like in 92, corporations want it, too.)

On ME foreign policy, bloggers are not responsible for the Iraq war going from bad to worse, nor for news about Iran that makes the candidates address it in a manner that upsets "netroots."

Gore is mainly responsible for the increase in global warming interest since 2004, and he's a hawkish centrist and a born again Christian, who knows all about what might be the grass roots potential of internet but chose instead to work with Hollywood.

The money Iraq is costing and the wretched Katrina response and things like a Minneapolis bridge crashing are the reason the frontrunners can try to sell ideas in the "more domestic spending" vein. The MSM was greatly responsible for Katrina entering the population pysche.

Obama has even dissed some of the Kos membership on the site itself and spoken ill of the site-- --see Yglesias Dec. 5. He courts the church organizations, more than "netroots."

I really don't see how "netroots" can take credit for anything here. There not organized, don't offer any coherent groups to pander to. Matt's implying Brooks is being his own goofy self again, while I think that may be true, it's because he often gets goofy rubbing in obvious things. It's also goofy for "netroots," whoever they self-identify as, to be thinking they've affected much so far at all. If there's any coherent "single view" concern that I can see of netroots, it's that there's a major hatred of Hillary because of hawkishness, and she's got the best poll numbers, and just Sun. was running around being hawkish on all the talk shows.

And last but not least, Edwards has obviously been trying to charm people like David Brooks.

It's not netroots that see a coordinated attack from the right wing, it's moveon.org that does. Talk about delusions of grandeur, sheesh.

I think the country would be at exactly the same place as it is right now if "netroots" never existed.

On second thought mabye not, maybe Dean would be president. :-)

MoveOn's a part of the netroots.

And that, generally, is the shape of things. "The left" has only been empowered to a pretty minor degree, but the "centrist" wing of the party is . . . way further left on the merits than where it was in the late 1990s or the early years of the twentieth century.

It certainly is true that Clinton, Obama and Edwards are well to the left of William Jennings Bryant and others who sought the Democratic nomination during the early Twentieth Century.

It also is true that all three are espousing positions to the left of those who ran for the Democratic nominating during the early Twenty-First Century.

Gotcha.

it's still also true that all of the Democrats are calling for substantial reductions of troop levels in Iraq, which none of the candidates (including Howard Dean) were doing in 2004.

Dennis Kucinich begs to disagree.

Hillary won't end the war. That's all that matters to the Beltway elite and it's all that matters to the party base. Hillary may be able to lie her way to the PResidency, but when she refuses to end the war the Democrats will lose congress in 2010, and she will lose the white house in 2012, either to a primary challenger or to the Republican party.

Well, this is quite interesting. Matt is correct that Hillary's appeal is based more on partisanship than on substantive centrism (domestic or foreign policy). In fact, Clinton's campaign is notable for its avoidance of substance, period, in most of its communications. The recent speech on healthcare was an exception. Her ads are GOP-style in that they seek to convey emotional messages and images, not policy checklists. That's all to the good in terms of a strategy for political success.

However, I think Brooks deserves more credit than Matt gives him for pointing out that the old Clinton hands are in the saddle again in the Democratic party. This doesn't just mean policy hands; it also means money men and political hands like Terry McAuliffe and Ann Lewis. And, at some vague level, Clinton is indeed promising Democratic primary/caucus voters a third Clinton term--a return to the supposedly glorious 1990s. Liberal Democrats, after 6+ years of GWB in the White House, are overwhelmed by Clinton nostalgia.

I am not convinced by Matt that Clinton is basically on board with the current liberal policy agenda as he is defining it. This argument from Matt echoes another basic element of Clinton's campaign strategy, which is to blur the differences within the Democratic field, in order to gain liberal support. Regrettably, the Clintons' political history--and make no mistake, HRC is presenting herself as WJC's political legatee, which she can do unobstructed since Gore is not in the race--is to say to liberal Democrats whatever is necessary, but leave themselves some wiggle room and then, once in office, say it's just not possible to deliver. HRC is evidently trusted by a plurality of the Democratic base, but, I must say, not by me. And Brooks is correct to suggest that liberals like me who feel that distrust are out in the cold right now, with the base--meaning most liberals, including some unions, which is pretty funny since the Clintons have never been pro-union Democrats--flocking to Clinton. We will see if they are disappointed.

>Hillary won't end the war. That's all that matters to the Beltway elite and it's all that matters to the party base. Hillary may be able to lie her way to the PResidency, but when she refuses to end the war the Democrats will lose congress in 2010, and she will lose the white house in 2012, either to a primary challenger or to the Republican party.

Of course Hillary will end the war (or more correctly, US troops involvement in Iraq's civil war). As will any Dem President, because they aren't stupid and they know they have to if they want a second term. They may take 18 months to do it, but we will be out before the 2010 elections. We may not be able to count on their principles, but we can count on their self-interest. (Unlike the poor GOP candidates, who are stuck with a base that won't let them end the war.)

'It's also goofy for "netroots," whoever they self-identify as, to be thinking they've affected much so far at all.'

George Allen is not a senator today because of the goofy netroots. Those goofy, ineffective netroots made the Democratic caucus in the senate a majority.

See, I think any of the Dem candidates, if elected President in '08 will shift left pretty quickly. The point for dems is to 'get elected' first. Say anything now and wink their way into office.

Greenwald's (excellent) response to Brooks' editorial: http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/2007/09/25/brooks/index.html

I think there is a fairly simple and well-known narrative that describes this situation better. The netroots emerged, in part, because the Democratic party leaders did not reperesent the views of the Democratic party voters. The netroots was proved right, more or less, in 2006. Then if you are a Democratic party bigwig, what are you going to do? Risk losing your influence? No, you move left and co-opt the netroots. Sure, there are plenty of people out there who want the party further left, but now we have Clinton with a pretty liberal health care plan and a putative commitment to getting out of Iraq. Sure, that may not happen, but the netroots are a much better informed group than your average voter. Thus foolish stuff like the perception that Clinton is liberal on foreign policy matters persists. That has a lot more to do with what the Republicans have done though. Nobody on the Democratic side really deserves the blame or credit for that.

Hillary has hired Kerry's netroots guy, Peter Daou. I had a small amount of contact with Daou during the campaign, and I came away positively impressed. His hands were tied during the campaign, probably by Mary Beth Cahill, but I'm convinced that if he had been listened to Kerry would have handled the netroots far better. I'm pretty sure that he wouldn't have signed on with Clinton if he hadn't come to an understanding about cewrtain things.

Daou and his hot wife used to be indie musicians.

Of course Hillary will end the war (or more correctly, US troops involvement in Iraq's civil war). As will any Dem President, because they aren't stupid and they know they have to if they want a second term. They may take 18 months to do it, but we will be out before the 2010 elections.

Hillary will not end the war. She has promised to keep tens of thousands of "residual forces" to fight "terrorists" and prop up the Iraqi "government", which will in point of fact mean continued deaths of brave US servicemembers and permanent military bases.

The only way to end the war is with a 100 percent withdrawal of all US forces and contractors. Hillary's plan is to continue the war while claiming she's ended it.

As usual, everyone ignores the elephant in the room: Iran.

Bush can derail the Dems at any instant just by launching the Iran war.

NONE of the Dems will oppose that war - except maybe Kucinich.

And where does that leave "withdrawal from Iraq"?

Oh, yeah, we'll "withdraw" all right - in an emergency evacuation under fire which will cost another five thousand US lives and 15,000 wounded.

Hillary will be a big help there, sure.

And Matt, email me when the Dems actually propose dealing with Iran the way it should be dealt with: with non-aggression guarantees, recognition of its right to enrichment, and some movement in the Israel-Palestine situation.

All the Dems "diplomatic talk" is just that: talk.

Matt, artappraiser, et al:
Please read Glenn Greenwald's expert evisceration of the reliably dishonest and fatuous David Brooks. How on earth can you folks even entertain the delusion that Brooks is 'right' on a number of points? His 'analysis' relies on distortion, deception, and sophistry. There is no 'there' there.
I am consistently mystified that Brooks is considered to be insightful and, laughably, an intellectual. I guess this is what passes for thinking among politicos and the press (Exhibit No. 1: dimbulb Charlie Rose staring in rapt attention as the spectacularly mediocre Tom Friedman intones his sonorous banalities).
Matt, why do you continue to pay lip-service to the hacks who have been bamboozling you all these years?

hum'n'mum:

Funny you should mention him. I was just reading something by him. You mean the Glen Greenwald who is so clueless about electorate that he doesn't even understand that California is the home not just of liberals but also supporters of Arnold Schwarzenegger and Ronald Reagan? The Glen Greenwald who doesn't appear to know that such a state, just because it has voted blue for president a few times, would be highly unlikely to elect two bonafide liberal senators much less one? California: it's not just LA & SF, it has conservative Democrats & gasp, even Republicans there. I really aghast, you know, I bet even David Brooks knows that.

Ah! Right-wing 'thought'!
While most given lemons will manage to make lemonade, the witless poltroons of the Right, presented those same lemons, will contrive to save only the pits. And so, their bafflement with ideas and logic.
Artappraiser: With your easy, ignorant confidence in the essential conservative 'values' of California voters, it must be especially mystifying that honorable Republican gangsters are conniving to subvert the electoral process, to steal the state's desperately coveted electoral votes.
More to the point: both of California's senators are Democrats. One a servile fool, the other a reliable liberal dinosaur, but DEMOCRATS. Or are you wily Republicans helping to elect female Democrats in a subtle scheme to eventually (with faith in Jesus) secure control of the state by your party? Gee, pretty AND clever!
What, exactly, is your ever-shrinking point?


Comments closed October 09, 2007.

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