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Actually Existing Conservatism

19 Oct 2007 03:11 pm

An excellent point here from Ezra Klein inspired by Greg Anrig's The Conservatives Have No Clothes which was excellent even when I read it several months ago before it had a pretty cover or nice paper: It doesn't mean anything to suggest that there's a "real" conservatism which exists in the Platonic heavens and is different from the agenda that conservative politicians in fact pursue.

One shouldn't just identify "conservatism" with "the policies pursued by George W. Bush" because in some instances (immigration most notably, but the insertion of greater federal control over schools to some extent and probably on some other things) he's faced some meaningful opposition from conservative politicians. On the other hand, while I don't think anyone would describe their philosophic approach to budget matters as "first cut taxes and then when looking at the spending side, focus cuts on programs for the poor rather than on corporate subsidies" but ever since the days of Reagan and Stockman it's consistently been the practice of conservative politicians to pay for tax cuts through a combination of debt and cuts to programs serving "weak clients" rather than "weak claims" on the merits.

That reality doesn't, on its own, discredit the other, less discreditable notion. But when we're talking about politics, the tenets of actually existing conservatism are the ones that matter. People who think there's some other notion of conservatism that would work need to first show they can make it have some influence over the conservative political party and the conservative movement before it makes sense to define "conservatism" by construing it as meaning something other than what the conservative politicians do.

[By the same token, e.g., there's some sense in which "liberals" -- people you might meet on the street or at your local left-of-center opinion magazine -- support adopting a less crazy attitude toward the "war on drugs" but whatever sense this is doesn't seem to extend Democratic Party congressional leaders or presidential candidates or translate into anything happening]

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Comments (33)

It's also important to note that while tax-cutting is perhaps the most important part of the actually-existing conservative agenda, they spend the brunt of their time and energy engaging in amoral pay-to-play favoritism for campaign contributors in the banking, finance, agribusiness, energy, pharmaceutical, defense, and communications sectors of the economy.

Also, the overwhelming majority of the party's elected officials are fanatically dedicated to the cause of starting insane wars and refusing to end them.

Therefore, perhaps we really shouldn't pay any attention whatsoever to the conservatives who insist that we ought to take their oh-so-precious Platonic ideals seriously.

The paleoconservatives are the authentic American conservatives. They oppose the third-world invasion of the U.S, oppose free trade, oppose interventionism (e.g. they anti-war in Bosnia, Iraq or Darfur), and support states'rights and regionalism.

Yeah, the "liberals" in Congress have been notable in their opposition to the agribusiness, banking, and finance lobbies. Just ask Tom Harkin and Hillary Clinton.

All sarcasm aside, the principle activity to which our "liberals" and "conservatives" are devoted is the operation of a gerontocracy, wherein wealth is transferred from younger, poorer, citizens, to retired, wealthier citizens.

And thus, those that have sincere and true principles are libertarians, who are united in their support of old people dying.

Yeah, RickM, those wealthier old people just can't take care of themselves, and the only thing seperating them from death is the 15% off the top from the paychecks of minimum wage employees.

All sarcasm aside, I hope they put Will Allen in the special nursing home for libertarians when he's living on a fixed income with massive medical expenses.

Golly, LP, given I pay premiums for long term care insurance, and don't expect taxpayers to pay for my care, so I can maximize the estate I pass to my heirs, why would you care where I live?

Shorter Will Allen

I'm taken care of, so who the hell cares about anyone else? They should take care of themselves. Every man from himself. Anything else=socialism.

Schadenfreude, obviously.

But you should seriously consider the special nursing home for libertarians. I hear the competition for prescription drugs is particularly fierce there.

Apparently, RickM, the word "wealthier" does not register with you. Yes, I believe people with assets, especially assets in excess of the population's median, should use or leverage those assets before tapping the paychecks of substantially poorer people.

I think Will Allen is saying that he'll be eating caviar while you eat cat food.

I guess stagflation and "malaise" defined liberalism in the late 70's because that is what Jimmy Carter acomplished. Silly post not worthy of Matt.

Bob, why on earth would a person with assets above the median level for the population, assets not be liquidated, for purposes of repaying taxpayers for benefits received until after death, be any more subject to eating cat food?

Will,
Maybe you should take your "assets above the median level for the population [and] assets not be liquidated" and learn how to write. Mmmm k?

Yeah, LP, that pretty much sums up the "progressive"; reveling in the misfortune of people the "progressive" disagrees with, no matter that such a person has done nothing to the "progressive".

RickM, maybe you should explain why wealthy people should be able to tap the paychecks of poor people, instead of making pointlessly insulting remarks. Mmmmm k? Look, I know the operation of a gerontocracy without regard to need is the cornerstone for your political faction. Why get so huffy when this is pointed out?

Once upon a time, people on the left would argue: don't equate communism, the ideal, with the policies actually enacted by commnunist countries. The right generally didn't buy it. Shoe, meet other foot.

No, Will, I just enjoy making fun of libertarians. I'm the one who wants your rich, decrepit ass to benefit from a tax levied on MY poor, hard-working heirs, remember? I revel in stodgy, bureaucratic programs that alleviate the misfortune of others.

But it would seem by your example that libertarians are summed up by their inability to distinguish humor from deep, philosophical argumentation.

Come to think of it, that would explain quite a lot.

LP, why do wish to impose misfortune on poor people to alleviate rich people of the misfortune of using their asstes to to care for themselves? Why do you hate poor people so much?

Will- They shouldn't. I don't know what this is supposed to prove, though.

I don't know what your larger complaint is about democrats and republicans supporting a gentocracy. The reason they do that is because MORE OLD PEOPLE VOTE. Its not some feature of liberal/conservative political ideology. If the libertarian political party obtained power, they would need receive the vote of the elderly. Of course, the libertarian party's platform is silly and politically impossible. Thus, they will continue to be irrelevant.

Well, that was my point, Rickm; the principle that Republicans and Democrats value most of all is the acquisition and maintainence of power, and all other principles are subservient to that, so whenever a Republican or a Democrat starts yammering about the moral superiority of their faction, it should be paid no attention, because when push comes to shove, the only thing that really matters to the Republican or Democrat is getting over on the opposition, and thus forcing others to submit to their will. No, I'm not a Libertarian either, or to most libertarians, even a member of their lower-case faction. I'll give them this much, however; they are reliably less moralistically thuggish than Republicans or Democrats.

Let's face it, Will is one of "those guys." Those guys that criticize the majority (in this sense, the dominant political parties) primarily so that he can feel superior. And the beauty of this is that he can rest comfortably in his belief in the superiority of his pet theory because he knows there's no way it will ever actually be tested and will always remain as simply "theory" and therefore, eternally perfect in theory.

However, those of us who actually have an interest in making real changes to the world need to actually, you know, do something, by, you know, acquring at least some level of power.

The two political parties have little to do with ideologies. One of them represents (roughly) oil/gas/arms manufacturers; the other finance/law firms/labor - something like that. Ideological rationalizations follow the money, that's all. In the existing two-party system each coalition is quite broad and self-contradictory; consequently ideological shams they put forward are often completely incoherent.

Doug-E, given I've advanced no theory here, other than to observe that the principal activity that Democrats and Republicans work to advance is the operation of a gerontocracy without regard to need, there is no untested theory I've put forth as "perfection".

abb1, I don't necessarily disagree much, but I'd simply add that the pricipal avenue of the advancement of those interests is via the purchase of older citizens' votes without regard to need.

[By the same token, e.g., there's some sense in which "liberals" -- people you might meet on the street or at your local left-of-center opinion magazine -- support adopting a less crazy attitude toward the "war on drugs" but whatever sense this is doesn't seem to extend Democratic Party congressional leaders or presidential candidates or translate into anything happening]

Right, but I don't think that the Democratic Party publicly identifies with 'liberalism' or actively aligns itself with 'the liberal movement' very much, and certainly does so nowhere near the extent to which the Republicans do so with 'conservatism'.

Re: I pay premiums for long term care insurance, and don't expect taxpayers to pay for my care

Well, it won't be your premiums that pay for that care should you someday need it. That money is already being spent by your insurer. It will be the premiums being paid by other people in that day. Insurance is also a form of socialism after all. And I always find it odd when people talk about "taxpayers" as if they were some unique species of life, when in reality "taxpayer" describes all of us.

The difference between voluntary associations and involuntary associations apparently escapes Jon, and he apparently is under the impression that there is no such thing as reserves in the insurance industry. No, Jon, a premium paid to an insurance company is not the same thing as FICA taxes, unless insurance companies gain the power to compel people yet born to pay premiums.

"I guess stagflation and "malaise" defined liberalism in the late 70's because that is what Jimmy Carter acomplished. Silly post not worthy of Matt.

Posted by Dave | October 19, 2007 5:27 PM"

Malaise and stagflation were not policies. MY here is talking about how conservative thought in practice is that taxes should be lowered while corporate welfare, but not social programs spending, increases. He is not arguing that conservativism is Katrina, 9/11 and the tsunami.

> I don't think that the Democratic Party publicly
> identifies with 'liberalism...

Yeah, though how much of that is because Repubs have so effectively demonized the idea of liberalism these last 30 years, and chicken Dems have run away from the label?

Incidentally, the Democratic party seems more conservative at the moment, trying to preserve whatever's left of the New Deal, and general New Deal-flavor policies.

The Republican party is, of course, much more liberal in the traditional sense a-la Milton Friedman. The Republican party (at the moment) is also militantly radical - liberating oppressed masses around the world, fighting religious tyrannies, creating a world-wide integrated economy and so on. To call them 'conservative' is as silly as calling the German Nazis 'conservatives'. They are more revolutionary than conservative.

Have Republicans gotten to the point where the term "family values" is just too punch line-inducing to use yet?

Yes. It's a matter of tautology whether you support your principles. What matters is whether you support the political act which may express them.


Comments closed November 02, 2007.

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