Context: The New Singling Out

James Fallows tried the other day to put debates over the clout of the "Israel lobby" into some context, noting the parallel power of the Cuban exile lobby and the recently demonstrated clout of Armenian emigres:

To observe these patterns, and warn against them (including the disastrous consequences of attacking Iran), is not to be anti-Armenian, anti-Orthodox, anti-Cuban, anti-Catholic, or anti-Semitic. Nor is it to deny that members of each lobby claim, and probably believe, that what they're recommending is best for America too. But in these cases they're wrong.

For his trouble, naturally, Commentary's Gabriel Schoenfeld responds by quoting Fallows in a way that elides all reference to Cubans and Armenians and then accuses Fallows of singling out the Jews: "But why is this game played only one way, with America’s Jews the primary target?"

Um....

Fallows says he's becoming "nostalgic for the comparative 'honesty' of the Chinese state media."

Comments

I think the right-wing commentariat is showing real signs of cognitive distress. Self-parody isn't normally regarded as an effective rhetorical technique.

Posted by MattF | October 23, 2007 10:58 AM

""But why is this game played only one way, with America’s Jews the primary target?""

This is however, EXACTLY the argument Walt and Mearsheimer are making--that is there is something unique and sinister about --"the Israel Lobby". Not that it exists and has some power. Fallows correctly shows this thesis to be false and reduces W&M thesis to the comically obvious---that all lobbying groups have power..

Posted by Dave | October 23, 2007 11:41 AM

Don't forget the role Hungarian exiles played in the abortive Hungarian uprising in the 1950s.

Posted by Harold | October 23, 2007 11:48 AM

Dave:

This is however, EXACTLY the argument Walt and Mearsheimer are making

While Schoenfeld is obviously a liar, I'm going to guess Dave is just very, very stupid.

Posted by grh | October 23, 2007 11:52 AM

1) Re Commentary's point ""But why is this game played only one way, with America’s Jews the primary target?"
---------
Actually, "America's Jews" are not the target. The Israel Lobby is.

For example, To note that the 25 prominent Neocons --whose deceitful propaganda led this nation into the disasterous Iraq war --are Jewish is NOT to criticize all Jews.

It is to explain the disloyalty of a few. Who have brought disaster upon the USA in the service of another country. Even Haaretz noted this.

It is the Israel Lobby which is Anti-Semitic, in my opinion. Because they argue that their disloyalty is characteristic of all American Jews.

They are like Julius Rosenberg arguing that he was acting on behalf of his "co-religionists" when he gave Stalin the atomic bomb. That every American Jew should have been willing to give a murderous Stalin the the bomb -- the power to turn every American city into a pile of ashes.

Of course, Uncle Joe murdered a lot of Russian Jews in his purges -- and an atomic strike on America would have killed most American Jews.

Two American Jews -- Roy Cohn and Irving Kaufman -- showed what they thought of Julius's argument by shoving Julius and fat Ethel's asses into the electric chairs so damm fast the angels blinked.

Yes, we have other ethnic lobbies. But few of them inject the huge sums into American politics that the Israel Lobby commands.

Show me a Cuban American or Armenian who tossed $15 MILLION into the Democratic Party in 2000-2002 the way Israeli billionaire Haim Saban did.
Show me an Armenian or Cuban American group which dominates and controls the mechanisms of national discourse to the extent the Israel Lobby does. And which engages in deceitful propaganda to anywhere near the same extent.

And the last time I looked, the Armenian lobby was not pushing the US Government to invade Turkey and overthrow the government.

The closest thing to the Israel Lobby I see is the Hispanic lobby -- whose push for millions of immigrants per year is deeply disloyal to their fellow Americans who need jobs and decent wages. But even there, the Hispanic lobby is largely the catspaw of corporations wanting cheap labor.

To some extant, the power of the Israel Lobby was amplified by the desire of Big Oil to undercut any Democratic opposition to seizing the deposits of Iraq. And the desire of Big Defense for war on any pretext -- and another petro-customer in the Middle East.

Posted by Don Williams | October 23, 2007 12:56 PM

Plus, Commentary is deliberately muddying the waters when they reduce the issue to political "factions".

We are not talking about "factions" -- we are talking about "DISLOYAL Factions" -- people who sacrified 3700+ Americans to their own ends.

Who have wasted $2 Trillion of badly needed tax dollars for their own ends.

Who have caused thousands of US citizens to be permanently crippled and condemmed to a life spent in VA hospitals.

Posted by Don Williams | October 23, 2007 1:01 PM

For every word written or spoken about the influence of Cuban-Americans or Armenian-Americans on U.S. politics & policy, (insert gigantic number) are written & spoken about the influence of Jewish Americans.

Of course Jews are singled out with regard to Washington influence, and that is the discussion Fallows was taking part in. The reason he brought up the Cuban and Amenian groups was, specifically, to defend critics of Jewish influence against charges of anti-Semitism.

Which is not to say that Jews shouldn't be singled out in this respect. Perhaps they should. (There are certainly valid reasons to think that U.S. policy in the Middle East is more important than the Cuba Embargo or silly resolutions about century-old stuff.) But let's not pretend that they are not singled out. Of course they are, which is why "The Cuba Lobby" and "The Armenia Lobby" are not exactly rocketing up the best-seller lists.

Posted by Gator90 | October 23, 2007 1:04 PM

"This is however, EXACTLY the argument Walt and Mearsheimer are making--that is there is something unique and sinister about --"the Israel Lobby". Not that it exists and has some power. Fallows correctly shows this thesis to be false and reduces W&M thesis to the comically obvious---that all lobbying groups have power."

No, they're not. Read the book.

Posted by Guy in Jersey | October 23, 2007 1:36 PM

Re Gator90 "Which is not to say that Jews shouldn't be singled out in this respect. Perhaps they should. "
--------------
1) But which "Jews" are supposed to represent all of the 12 Tribes?

Marty Peretz or Matthew Yglesias?

Richard Perle or Josh Marshall?

William Kristol or MJ Rosenberg?

2) The vast majority of America's Jews are middle class citizens who don't even know what is going on. Their aggregate votes, campaign donations, and media influence don't amount to all that much.
Why should they be blamed for the malign acts of the Neocons?

On the other hand, the 5 million German and East European Jews who died in the Holocaust were not involved in the wartime deals the Zionists made with British PM David Lloyd George -- or with the legalized looting done at Versailles. But it was those Jews paid the price. If Iraq turns to shit, Big Oil's sock puppets are going on the talk shows a few years hence and say "It's was all the Jews fault."

3) Plus, the Israel Lobby should --to some extent --be named the "Plutocrat's Lobby". Because a lot of its money comes from non-Jewish billionaires like Rupert Murdoch -- who probably wouldn't care if Israel was nuked off the face of the globe.

But those plutocrats don't want to pay taxes -- so they constantly try to drive wedges into the Democratic Party -- to "divide and conquer". They -- and their puppets like Bush/Cheney -- are pandering in an extreme way to billionare supporters of Israel in order to move the campaign donations of those billionaires to the Republican coffers and away from the Democratic coffers. To "starve the beast".

Knowing that doing so puts Democratic leaders on the horns of a dilemna -- either they risk losing $millions or they go along with the pandering and alienate their base. The Democratic base rightfully believing that a party which claims to represent the common citizen should not waste that citizen's life or money in unnecessary wars.

The Plutocrats, of course, like that debate. It diverts the populace and national conversation away from issues like income inequality, corruption, how the common citizens is screwed badly by political favoritism, monopolies, etc etc.

Posted by Don Williams | October 23, 2007 1:54 PM

For every word written or spoken about the influence of Cuban-Americans or Armenian-Americans on U.S. politics & policy, (insert gigantic number) are written & spoken about the influence of Jewish Americans.

That's because people can talk about the Cuban exiles without without being accused of Hispanic-hatred in every newspaper and news magazine in America. If you put speakers on every rooftop and announce that Joe Blow is a terrorist people will wonder who Joe Blow is, and why you're so concerned about him; and if the charges are flimsy these people will tell you so.

Posted by Matt Stevens | October 23, 2007 2:32 PM

Don,

Hard to disagree with your analysis.

It really, really sucks to be in the same ethno-religious group as Marty Peretz.

Posted by Gator90 | October 23, 2007 2:41 PM

Matt Stevens,

Why do you hate Jews? (Dude I'm so totally kidding.)

In seriousness though, who is "Joe Blow" in your analogy, and who is calling him a terrorist on flimsy grounds? I'm not sure I'm following you.

Posted by Gator90 | October 23, 2007 2:46 PM

Re Gator's comment "It really, really sucks to be in the same ethno-religious group as Marty Peretz. "
-------
Yep. That phrase "The Chosen People" can be taken two different ways.

"Chosen" to take the shitty end of the stick, historically.

Especially when some goyim need a scapegoat for their own fuckups -- or have some debts they don't want to pay off.

Posted by Don Williams | October 23, 2007 3:06 PM

the 5 million German and East European Jews who died in the Holocaust were not involved in the wartime deals the Zionists made with British PM David Lloyd George -- or with the legalized looting done at Versailles. But it was those Jews paid the price.

Don,

So the Jewish victims of the Holocuast were killed because of "wartime deals" between Zionists and the British Prime Minister?

Are you sure about that?

Posted by SoCalJustice | October 23, 2007 3:33 PM

The comment section attached to Schoenfeld's piece make interesting reading. Pretty much every single one calls him on the dishonesty of his argument.

Posted by hwestiii | October 23, 2007 3:34 PM

In his Farewell Address of 1796, George Washington (assisted by Alexander Hamilton, James Madison, and John Jay) explained with prophetic clarity the dangers of the various lobbies for foreign countries:

"Sympathy for the favorite [foreign] nation, facilitating the illusion of an imaginary common interest in cases where no real common interest exists, and infusing into one the enmities of the other, betrays the former into a participation in the quarrels and wars of the latter without adequate inducement or justification... Against the insidious wiles of foreign influence (I conjure you to believe me, fellow-citizens) the jealousy of a free people ought to be constantly awake … Real patriots who may resist the intrigues of the favorite are liable to become suspected and odious, while its tools and dupes usurp the applause and confidence of the people, to surrender their interests."

Posted by Steve Sailer | October 23, 2007 4:08 PM

To enlarge on Steve Sailer's point.

Washington's words are all anyone needs to understand the Israeli lobby or any other special interest lobby or the people behind them. And the American founders warned us about this a long time ago.

They understood that our "democratic tools" of representation and free speech would make America a perfect target and vehicle for those who would pervert those democratic engines to their use for their foreign or special interest purpose.

All the claims by the Israeli lobby apologist that they are just doing what other lobbies do matter not. We know what they are all doing. They have "perverted" our "democratic engines" to use for their own interest against the interest of the whole of America.

Jewish, Cuban, corporate criminal, doesn't matter "who" they are, it only matters that the American public understands "what" they are and
"what" they are doing.

I do not accept that being "self deluded" is an excuse for not being held responsible or not being dennounced for their delusions.

"And it gives to ambitious, corrupted, or deluded citizens (who devote themselves to the favorite nation), facility to betray or sacrifice the interests of their own country, without odium, sometimes even with popularity; gilding, with the appearances of a virtuous sense of obligation, a commendable deference for public opinion, or a laudable zeal for public good, the base or foolish compliances of ambition, corruption, or infatuation

Because even the self deluded cannot deny that this is what this foreign loyalty obbession or corruption or delusion has led to for America:

"It leads also to concessions to the favorite nation of privileges denied to others which is apt doubly to injure the nation making the concessions; by unnecessarily parting with what ought to have been retained, and by exciting jealousy, ill-will, and a disposition to retaliate, in the parties from whom equal privileges are withheld."

Most Americans understand that political corruption is exactly how this perversion of our democratic tools like freedom of speech and right to representation has come about and how it works.

The only practical question is how long until this corruption of America by lobbies will go on before it provokes that final crisis that will shake the country to it's very foundations and crack the government wide open.

Posted by Renfro | October 23, 2007 4:53 PM

"Fallows says he's becoming "nostalgic for the comparative 'honesty' of the Chinese state media."

Yup. As I've said numerous times, intellectual dishonesty and intellectual cowardice are the hallmark characteristics of Zionists and neocons.

Ask Josh Marshall - he's got some of both.

Posted by Richard Steven Hack | October 23, 2007 7:17 PM