« Day One | Main | Obama, the War, and the Opportunity »

Obama on the Economy

14 Feb 2008 02:41 pm

Since I know a lot of people claim to be perturbed by Obama's alleged lack of detailed, specific talk about policy issues, I'm sure all those people took the time to read his speech in Jamesville, Wisconsin on the economy but perhaps not everyone got the chance to take a look at the policy white paper (PDF) associated with the speech. The credit card bill of rights has a lot of appeal:

  • Ban Unilateral Changes: Currently, credit card companies can unilaterally change the terms of a credit card agreement at any time for any reason with only a 15-day notice to the consumer. Barack Obama will ban these unilateral changes in credit card agreements unless companies have obtained written consent from consumers and have followed the rules and terms of the agreement.
  • Apply Interest Rate Increases Only to Future Debt: Credit card companies often apply increased interest rates to both new debt incurred by the cardholder, as well as previously incurred debt. Barack Obama will require increased interest rates to apply only to future credit card debt, and not to debt incurred prior to the increase.
  • Prohibit Interest on Fees: Credit card companies often charge interest on transaction fees, such as late fees or paying a bill by telephone. Barack Obama will prohibit credit card issuers from charging interest on transaction fees.
  • Prohibit “Universal Defaults”: “Universal defaults” are a practice in which a credit card company raises an individual’s interest rate based on failure to pay a different creditor on time. Barack Obama will prohibit this practice.
  • Require Prompt and Fair Crediting of Cardholder Payments: Barack Obama will require credit card issuers to apply payments first to the credit card balance with the highest rate of interest and to minimize finance charges.

But the most substantial proposal from the speech was probably the call for the creation of a National Infrastructure Bank, which I believe is based on a proposal Chris Dodd and Chuck Hagel made back in August 2007. It's a good issue for Obama, since on one level it's a kind of goo-goo process reform question about changing the way the budget works, but on another level it's a very bread-and-butter question of sustaining the demand for workers in the construction sector and building infrastructure to keep America plugging along. Basically, it meshes well with his existing political persona but reaches out to a broader set of concerns than the ones his campaign's usually been associated with.

Share This

Comments (96)

The funding for infrastructure proposal is also ties by Obama to ending the Iraq war. Tying Iraq to crumbling infrastructure is a good way to remind voters literally and symbolically that the Iraq issue is not just about bad foreign policy, but that it's about what it means to throw away in excess of one trillion dollars: your country crumbles and falls apart at home.

Now that Clinton is focusing attention on Wisconsin and Ohio, it looks like she is trying to position herself as an old-fashioned anti-business, anti-bank populist. Obama needs to go right after this and document Clinton’s very ample record as a pro-business, DLC Democrat; highlight their differences on issues such as bankruptcy legislation; recall her service on the board of the ant-union Walmart, etc.

He also needs to keep asking the public to consider what’s in those tax returns she won’t release.

Good effort, MY, but it will likely be for naught. Those who like to claim that Barack Obama is a lightweight on the issues do so because it is a talking point of someone else's campaign.

Those who spout talking points are going to stop, merely because they're confronted with "facts." It would be nice to think that you could convince them of the error of their ways, but that sort of thinking doesn't really happen on that side.

Good effort, MY, but it will likely be for naught. Those who like to claim that Barack Obama is a lightweight on the issues do so because it is a talking point of someone else's campaign.

Those who spout talking points aren't going to stop, merely because they're confronted with "facts." It would be nice to think that you could convince them of the error of their ways, but that sort of thinking doesn't really happen on that side.

All this lofty rhetoric from Obama...why can't we get any specifics?

/sarcasm off

Sure Trigger, but if he starts stumping with this stuff, there are going to be undecideds who break for him. At some point, talking points are only effective if there's something to back them up.

I'm an Obama supporter, but I did hear some populist rhetoric of his the other day that I didn't like. He was bashing NAFTA, which I guess is good politics in Wisconsin and Ohio.

I'm reflexively pro free trade, and I assumed NAFTA has been a good thing, although I'll admit I honestly don't really know.

Good effort Trigger,

You managed to work several pro-Obama talking points in to your rant while simultaneously disparaging the other side for spouting talking points. You are probably such a true-believer that the hypocrisy and disingenousness of your remarks went unnoticed.

Jake - good point.

And, apologies to all for the double post.

I think Matt already linked to this, but if any of you are curious about Obama's economic policies reading that white paper and this article is a good start:

Closing Income Gap Tops Obama’s Agenda for Economic Change

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/02/us/politics/02obama.html?pagewanted=1&_r=2

Yeah, that Infrastructure Bank thing sounded like a good idea... until the Straight Talk Express informed me that Obama didn't just make that policy up right there on the spot. Apparently synthesizing different ideas from advisers and other lawmakers is policy plagiarism.

Sounds like someone's ready to lead on Day 1!

FYI - Obama has no core beliefs. Everything is open to compromise and negotiation. Everything.

The fresh Clinton spin is that Obama "stole" his economic plan from Clinton. One would think the ability to recognize a good idea put forth by one's opponent and incorporate it into one's own program would be an asset, not a liability, but I guess it just goes against the Clinton narrative that Obama is an unprincipled lightweight and a big meanie too.

Um no its plagiarism when you steal other people's ideas--almost word for word. Its even more audacious when that person is your opponent.


Senator Obama’s only “new” ideas were ones that Senator Clinton proposed months ago:

* His “new” proposal for a national infrastructure bank is one that Hillary proposed August 8, 2007. [“I’m proud to co-sponsor Senator Dodd and Senator Hagel's National Infrastructure Bank Act that we just introduced to establish a federally-backed independent bank that will evaluate and finance large infrastructure projects by subsidies, loan guarantees, and bonds backed by the full faith and credit of the United States.” Rebuilding America speech, 8/8/07; S. 1926, 8/1/07]
http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d110:SN01926:@@@P
http://www.hillaryclinton.com/news/speech/view/?id=3889

* His “new” proposal to create 5 million green collar jobs was proposed by Hillary on November 5, 2007. [“And three, to move us from a carbon-based economy to an efficient, green economy by unleashing a wave of private-sector innovation in clean energy and energy efficiency. I believe that will create at least five million good new jobs from clean energy over the next decade.” Energy and Climate speech, 11/5/07]
http://www.hillaryclinton.com/news/speech/view/?id=4059

o Google CEO Eric Schmidt praises Hillary’s plan to create 5 million Green Collar jobs, 11/5/07: “By emphasizing the connection between promoting a green efficient economy and job creation, Senator Clinton’s plan seeks to harness the power of technology and innovation to address one of our most pressing global challenges…The goal of producing 5 million new jobs can be achieved by private sector investment and bipartisan support for increased research and development in efficiency and clean energy.”


Where are all his great policy ideas again? It appears he can only get them from Hillary.

He'd make a great VP--making speeches about Hillary's policies. hahaha

Katie,

What next state that doesn't count does Hillary plan on losing?

Obama is a lightweight and a water carrier for his donors. The fact Clinton is losing to a ambitious fraud says more about her and her campaign than it does him.

Does anyone else find it ironic that katie appears to be cutting-and-pasting from the Hillary e-mail that was sent out? Talk about plagiarism.

Obama is a lightweight and a water carrier for his donors

Stay classy, conservatives.

SoCalJustice--

That's all you can say to a fact-based criticism eh?

You're insults are as empty as your candidate.

Tell me--how did you "come to Obama." Do you drink his blood as wine and eat some crackers every night?

Obama is water-carrier to 700,000 + working class everyday citizens? Awesome

Interesting proposals on credit card regulations. But they nibble at the edge. If he were proposing a ceiling on interest rates of, say, 12 percent (or whatever percent over prime that works out to today), that would be really interesting.


Facts facts facts people. It sure is hard to respond to those eh?

Bring on the insults! I'll stick with my reality-based not speech-based politics.

Looks like Hillary "plagiarized" her green collar jobs initiative from Edwards, who proposed something similar back in July.

http://www.johnedwards.com/news/press-releases/20070713-green-collar-jobs/

But it's ok if you're a Clinton!

I'm not convinced that it's too late for this...

I posted on this -- http://napatriot.blogspot.com/2008/02/obamas-specifics-details-solutions.html

and got a huge number of hits. All it takes is a little work on his site to get a huge amount of detail. It's been there for months. It's not that he is light on specifics, it's that the media is heavy on covering his soaring speeches.

Folks, just in case you haven't been paying attention, some recent history:
When Obama announced his candidacy a year ago, he got an enormous immediate bounce from almost unanimously positive media coverage. But by late August, word began filtering out that he was a bit of a bust at campaigning. (Don't trust me, look it up) People began to whisper that he was too "professorial," too detailed oriented. It wasn't what they expected.
But hey, as we say in the 'hood, Obama's mama didn't raise no dumb children.
By early fall, Obama had thrown out much of the detail - the policy that Hillary supporters attack him for not having - and started emphasizing that "hope" pitch, and "yes you can," and all that stuff.
I'm a big Obama supporter and I really can't bear to watch him speak now - and that's because I'm one of those wonky policy freaks.
But you gotta admit, the red meat - all that "we" can do it stuff - really works.
The boy (oh, the Man) ain't stupid; really, he's been a brilliant politician, so far.

well of course...and if you're Obama right Josh?

katie,

I can see second place suits you well too.

Welcome back.

Things haven't gone quite so well since you first appeared here, huh?

What's it been?

Your hero is 0-8?

Clearly it's annoying to be losing to a "cult leader."

It's both a little sad - and very funny - to watch all of you lash out like this.

I am starting to feel sorry for Hillary.

First, she "loans" herself $5 million because her campaign misspent and miscalculated.

Then she fired that poor woman, her loyal campaign manager.

Then her deputy quit. And Mark Penn continues to make an ass out of himself every time he opens his mouth.

If only her staff was "ready on day one." Since they clearly weren't, now we'll never know if Hillary was.

And that's clearly driving you insane with rage.

Oh well.


So you admit that Hillary is accusing Obama of stealing an idea that she herself stole from Edwards? The point above is that we shouldn't care if someone recognizes that their opponent has a good idea and decides to support it as well, as long as the idea is a good one. But it appears all you've got is "Stealer!! No backsies infinity!!"

Thanks for all the substance SoCal. The insults are great. Let me know when you want to discuss the issues.

Oh wait--no issues. Just all the 'hope' you're spewing. Is 'hope' the new 4 letter word?

How about responding to this instead?

In recent weeks, the Obama camp has repeatedly charged that Hillary was pro-NAFTA during her husband's presidency, an allegation the Obama campaign has used to try to weaken her support among a critical constituency, working-class voters. The Hillary camp has responded by saying that Obama's sourcing for the charge was flimsy at best.

Well, a new report says that the Hillary camp is right on this one. The Huffington Post talked to biographers of the First Lady and former advisers to Bill Clinton, and they all said Hillary was against the trade deal the whole time, even if she was constrained from saying so publicly.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/02/14/did-hillary-clinton-reall_n_86674.html?view=print

Hey Katie...get your facts straight

On a separate note, presidential candidates borrowing from one another's plans isn't all that uncommon. Clinton herself borrowed heavily from the climate plans of Obama and Edwards. Though she's now claiming that she was the first to tie her climate plan to economic stimulus in the form of new "green collar jobs," that was a central component of both Obama and Edwards' plans -- which both came out well before Clinton's Nov. 5 speech on the subject that her camp is touting as the "original" discussion of the matter.

tapped

katie,

you're doing it again.

look at you.

you write, "Bring on the insults! I'll stick with my reality-based not speech-based politics."

Just like you did last time, except you forget the part where you hurl worse insults, with more frequency.

There is a word in the English language for that.

It rhymes with hypocrite.

The Clinton supporters are doing her no favors, yet again.

Also, I think its pretty clear I'm not the one being 'driven insane with rage.'

I guess that’s what happens when your savior is being proven out to be a fraud.

Sunset - Obama threw out campaigning on policy have he was crushed by Bobby Rush in 2000. David Axelrod's playbook only has two things "hope" and "change". Obama 2008 is better Patrick 2006 that was revamped Obama 2004 which was beta tested as Edwards 2004.

Does no one read the Chicago Tribune?

Anyone who works in large (or small) organizations know that final strategies and plans are made with input, collaboration, and ideas from its members. No one candidate owns a plan these days - there's been too much discussion between all the players in Congress, think tanks, and among policymakers.

The key is how they will go about implementing these plans. Will they be able to get support from thier colleagues? Will they be able to drive the changes and get buy-in from all groups involved? Who has the best approach to implemeting change?

Also, I think its pretty clear I'm not the one being 'driven insane with rage.'

Hmm.

Obviously you don't understand the meaning of the words "pretty clear."

You're pretty frothy - and not too many other people here are.

Losing to a "cult leader" and a "fraud" - that's really gotta sting.

And it's only going to get worse.

Please stick around - because this will be fun.

I wonder if Katie would complain if Bush stole someone's idea for leaving Iraq.

Frankly, I tend to think just going back to the old bankruptcy law would be preferable.

Wouldn't it be easier to just teach people how to do math so they can figure out how much debt they can afford?

Read newspapers:
I stand corrected. (seriously)

See, this is the sort of in-fighting that can take the certainty of a Democrat winning the White House next fall and potentially turn it into four more years of the same ol'. It wasn't my intent to play a role in that, but I suppose it's easy to get swept up into the rhetoric.

The fact is that I'm a centrist Democrat, who borders on the left-liberal side of things. I would happily support either Clinton or Obama in the general election, but I happen to believe that Obama would make a better candidate and a better president.

Of course their policies are going to look similar, Katie (and Josh). They're not that far apart on many issues. The question is going to be which one of them will be better able to convince legislators and laymen alike that their plans are the best plans?

No, Barack Obama isn't perfect, and he is not a messiah. But he has the charisma that a leader needs, as well as the ability to listen to those advisors around him. Clinton is sometimes shrill, and while I appreciate her as a Senator, being one of her constituents, she is better in Congress, where her polarization won't paralyze the process. (Liberal love of illiteration.)

That's the bottom line.

SN: Exactly! I imagine Pelosi, Reid et al might want a little imput. Also, if there are still 40 senators from the GOP, you're going to need their votes to end debate. But I'm sure Hillary! locks herself in her room every night writing white papers with absolutely no imput from anyone else. She also knows how to field strip an AK-47 blindfolded and can fly an Apache gunship.

I am unconvinced by these policy details. After all, "words are cheap."

The Huffington Post talked to biographers of the First Lady and former advisers to Bill Clinton, and they all said Hillary was against the trade deal the whole time, even if she was constrained from saying so publicly.

So she was against it but just didn't say or do anything about it? LMFAO!!! Is that the kind of experience that comprises part of her 35 years? No thanks.

There's leadership you can count on alright.

Katie,

Those talking points actually come from John McCain's economic advisor, Kevin Hassett from AEI. Do you really want to be quoting that stuff? Does Hillary? (Plus, let's be serious. Hillary didn't sit down and write up these policies, this stuff is in the air, advisors make the details, and they are all borrowing from the same think tanks and scholars. Seriously.)

For more on Hassett's role go here:

http://blogs.tnr.com/tnr/blogs/the_plank/archive/2008/02/14/mccain-aiding-clinton.aspx

http://www.prospect.org/csnc/blogs/tapped_archive?month=02&year=2008&base_name=friends_in_low_places

http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0208/Claiming_theft.html

Hey,
It's JaNesville, not Jamesville.

Katie, please point us to Hillary Clinton's plan to ban unilateral and retroactive changes to credit card interest rates. Since you claim that Obama is stealing all his best ideas from Clinton, this must be her idea, right?

Go ahead and research her position on this issue and get back to us, ok? We'll be waiting.

Hey,
It's JaNesville, not Jamesville.

FYI - Obama has no core beliefs. Everything is open to compromise and negotiation. Everything.
...
The fact Clinton is losing to a ambitious fraud says more about her and her campaign than it does him.
...
You're insults are as empty as your candidate.

Tell me--how did you "come to Obama." Do you drink his blood as wine and eat some crackers every night?
...
Oh wait--no issues. Just all the 'hope' you're spewing. Is 'hope' the new 4 letter word?

Good thing I read Krugman or else I might think that maybe Hillary's supporters are more than a little irrationally venemous. But of course I know that the real story here is just about Obama brainwashing the entire nation into raving lunatics.


FYI - Obama has no core beliefs. Everything is open to compromise and negotiation. Everything.
...
The fact Clinton is losing to a ambitious fraud says more about her and her campaign than it does him.
...
You're insults are as empty as your candidate.

Tell me--how did you "come to Obama." Do you drink his blood as wine and eat some crackers every night?
...
Oh wait--no issues. Just all the 'hope' you're spewing. Is 'hope' the new 4 letter word?

Good thing I read Krugman or else I might think that maybe Hillary's supporters are more than a little irrationally venemous. But of course I know that the real story here is just about Obama brainwashing the entire nation into raving lunatics.


FYI - Obama has no core beliefs. Everything is open to compromise and negotiation. Everything.
...
The fact Clinton is losing to a ambitious fraud says more about her and her campaign than it does him.
...
You're insults are as empty as your candidate.

Tell me--how did you "come to Obama." Do you drink his blood as wine and eat some crackers every night?
...
Oh wait--no issues. Just all the 'hope' you're spewing. Is 'hope' the new 4 letter word?

Good thing I read Krugman or else I might think that maybe Hillary's supporters are more than a little irrationally venemous. But of course I know that the real story here is just about Obama brainwashing the entire nation into raving lunatics.


Oops. Sorry about the triple post.

Goo goo?

I must have not been at the right parties to learn this reference...

Please dumb it down a little Matt!

Thanks for the post. As far as the proposals, I don't think it's all that daring. No retroactive increasing interest rates is great; the unilateral changes ban will just end up taken care of in the meat of the credit card contract which everyone has to signe but 99.99% of credit card holders don't read anyway (making it patronization for the masses, but not a threat at all to the industry). The prohibition of interest on transaction fees will put a little more money back in a card-holder's pocket. All in all, the proposal will put a little bit of money back in peoples' pockets, maybe help keep a few people out of default, and basically only help enough to matter with a few of the very poorest of the poor.

If this as offered up to show that Barack Obama is Ghandi or Martin Luther King, Jr., it falls a little short. But let's hope the party as a whole keeps heading in the direction of these kinds of changes, and makes an agenda like this what we can expect instead of what they dazzle us with as one of their highest accomplishments.

Matt why aren't you reinforcing the all fluff and no substance meme.. Too bad some people are so lazy that they cant research the candidates like I did when I read Obama's blue print for change..

http://www.barackobama.com/pdf/ObamaBlueprintForChange.pdf

http://www.barackobama.com/issues/

Anyway Obama can't win because early in the race people said he was too substantive and profesorial now he is no substance.. Make up your freakin minds..Here are quotes from reporters and bloggers complaining about it earlier in the race:

"Nix the professorial tone and give shorter answers. Do more to explicitly distinguish your opinions with that of President Bush and the Republican candidates."-Dana Goldstein

"Obama already suffers from coming across as too professorial and upper crust."Drew Cline

"He's something, as says, you'd expect in a Harvard seminar for undergraduates or something like that."-Chuck Todd

"That isn't who he is. I mean, people keep describing it as professorial. He does strike me as a professor. He's like a guy at Harvard or Yale, who, after a 90-minute lecture to a bunch of students, will have all the students waiting for an autograph or wanting to spend more time with the professor"- Chuck Todd

It's JANESVILLE not jamesville. Home of me and Russ Feingold.

right wrote: "Wouldn't it be easier to just teach people how to do math so they can figure out how much debt they can afford?"

That's hard when the credit card company can change the terms at will, slap you with fees, and jack up your interest rate, and your only out is to pay the full balance of the card.

People can afford more debt at 15% than they can at 29%. If the card issuer jacks the rate up, the debt that is affordable today might not be tomorrow.

She also knows how to field strip an AK-47 blindfolded and can fly an Apache gunship.

Let's just start calling it "an Apache helicopter" from now on, so those who aren't "in the know" can follow the conversation, and don't think this is something like a Boeing Flying Fortress or an A-10 Warthog...

I'm truly amazed at how well the Obama campaign is running. It's being said about his delegate strategy and his ground game, but he's also been able to anticipate and position himself almost perfectly for every criticism. I think Obama was just waiting for the right moment to put this plan out there. He's unveiling this thing precisely when he needs to. The timing is superb. The Republicans have started to attack him as being devoid of substance while at the same time the primary campaign moves into Ohio. Could you be more perfectly positioned to make your economic pitch? It allows Obama to respond to the Republican charges, which only makes him look more presidential, while at the same time campaigning on the issues of greatest concern in the upcoming primaries. Obama's campaign always seems ready for what's coming next.

Perhaps katie has a point when she said these are just ideas that Hillary has already endorsed, but so what? Hillary's UHC plan belonged to John Edwards by that standard. She's in no position to criticize the tactic. And it's not like those are original ideas anyway.

Katie, that was stupid and offensive. I'd be tempted to say if this is the caliber of adherents Clinton draws, it's no wonder they can't find their way to the election sites, but I'm sure most of Clinton's supporters are light years ahead of you in maturity and knowledge.

All in all, the proposal will put a little bit of money back in peoples' pockets, maybe help keep a few people out of default, and basically only help enough to matter with a few of the very poorest of the poor.

No. These rules would have saved me hundreds of dollars in recent years, and I'm by no means the poorest of the poor. This type of reform matters, at least a little bit, to a large number of people. Basic economic fairness and the willingness to block exploitative corporate behavior... these types of policies are why people used to vote Democratic back when Democrats cared about these things.

NAFTA's been largely responsible for the surge in unauthorized immigrants from Mexico, since it wrecked the Mexican economy. By forcing Mexico to take US agricultural goods without tariffs, even though the government has been giving massive subsidies to US farmers, Mexican agriculture was mostly wiped out, leaving the rural poor with nothing to do but to cross the border.

don't think this is something like a Boeing Flying Fortress or an A-10 Warthog...

It doesn't matter. Hillary can repair those using nothing but twine and making tape, at the same time she writes one dissertation on particle physics and another on 17th-century French Literature.

We're supposed to be impressed by that? Where's his proposal to cap interest rates at a reasonable level?

Almost all states had usury laws before a federal court decision effectively preempted them in the 80s. We need a federal usury law, but we ain't gonna get one from Hillary or Obama.

Ann are two Chuck Todd quotes supposed to represent what "everybody" (on the blogosphere, or who talks about politics) was saying at first? Chuck Todd is an MSM figure who appears frequently on Hardball! He certainly is the same kind as Matt!

The Drew Cline quote was pulled out of some weird piece which was apparently a hit-piece on Obama and liberals in general, trying to paint us as not back-woodsy and working-class enough. In the same piece, Drew Cline wrote:

"Obama already suffers from coming across as too professorial and upper crust. These types of campaign surrogates will only solidify that image. What he needs are some good, old-fashioned union guys, a NASCAR driver or maybe a country singer. A male country singer . . . He’s got to show that he understands regular folks and can communicate with them."

I think Drew Cline is a mini-version of all the pieces of crap who are screwing up the NYT opinion page. The sentence taken from the context of him trying to say "All liberals think they are smarter than you, and you should resent them for it and for having good educations" isn't really a good piece of evidence to show that "everybody" was calling Obama a smart, detail-oriented policy man at first, and that somehow a bunch of pundits unfairly switched on him and started calling him an airhead after he gave more eloquent speeches.

So then the one other quote you have is the Goldstein one.

It's a really good speech, the kind of thing I was looking for from Obama. I wanted to know how he thinks about these issues. I'm in the absurd position of having voted for Hillary, because universal healthcare was a deal-breaker for me, but rooting for Obama because that's my instinctive preference.

I'd like to see Obama questioned once about his assertion that people don't buy health insurance because they can't afford it. A lot of students can get insurance cheaply through their colleges (I think 25-40$ a month in some cases) This is clearly affordable (though still $500 a year, a significant chunk of change), yet some don't buy it.

There is a difference between health insurance being affordable, and being cost-free or requiring no sacrifices. This is why it's important for a system to be universal, even if it requires a mandate, to emphasize that buying health insurance and preventive health care before you get sick are necessities, not luxuries. Allowing an individual or family to go without health insurance or preventive health care when they are healthy is not doing them any favors, except in the shortest of short-terms.

Looks like I had a typo-- that was supposed to be "He certainly is not the same kind as Matt!" at the end of my first paragraph, last comment.

Hardball is a suspect forum, too, as far as I'm concerned.

I'm an Obama supporter, but I did hear some populist rhetoric of his the other day that I didn't like. He was bashing NAFTA, which I guess is good politics in Wisconsin and Ohio.

I'm reflexively pro free trade, and I assumed NAFTA has been a good thing, although I'll admit I honestly don't really know.

Posted by Jim W


Speaking as an Obama supporter and someone who is generally critical of "free trade," I have to disagree that Sen. Obama "bashed" NAFTA.

He mentioned the Clinton administration's role in passing NAFTA, and noted that NAFTA has been criticized. But rather than criticize it himself, he just said "well I don't know about that, but..." and proceeded to talk about including labor and environmental standards in future trade deals.

I don't personally think that this position is ideal (see the writings of Ha-Joon Chang and Naila Kabeer if you want to find out why) but he is certainly far from actually trash talking NAFTA and the general policy of free trade.

Swan:

1. The Apache thing was my inner geek emerging and the fact that I lived near the plant where they were being assemble as a youngster.

2. I used to also subscribe to the "Dems need to be more beer and less wine" opinion until I saw Obama in So. Illinois when he ran for senate surrounded by "real Americans" hanging on his every word.

#2 is why I laugh at the "Clinton leads Obama by 17 in Ohio" headlines. Just wait till Obama shows up at a closed storefront in Youngstown with 15,000 white people who were mill empolyees until it closed and moved abroad. That lead will start shrinking real quick. "Part of my opponent's experience was being at the White House when NAFTA was signed. Oh yeah, Hillary was there too. In fact, her last name is on the treaty"

The stuff writes itself.

"This type of reform matters, at least a little bit, to a large number of people. Basic economic fairness and the willingness to block exploitative corporate behavior... these types of policies are why people used to vote Democratic back when Democrats cared about these things."

Yep. These changes would prevent the banks from being able to f**k you up at their whim.

That ought to help a bit with the financial insecurity that pretty much everyone is feeling these days.

It doesn't matter. Hillary can repair those using nothing but twine and making tape, at the same time she writes one dissertation on particle physics and another on 17th-century French Literature.

So, Hillary is MacGyver?

Hey, Matt, when ya going to ban 'SoCalJustice'? It's kinda sickening to see all those insults trashing up a comments thread.

I've been trying to resist concluding that Sen. Clinton's supporters are a pack of dimwits, but it's getting harder.

Can both Obama's and Clinton's supporters just cool the two minute hates for each other and their candidates. Jesus! We should be so proud of our party that we've been able to produce two such stellar, history-making candidates. Instead, you all are acting like toddlers. (Actually sorry - that's giving toddlers a bad name.) If the stakes weren't so high, I'd say this is the kind of behavior that makes me think the Democrats don't deserve to win in Nov.

I guess it's not a big deal if we call it a gunship just because gunship is cooler-sounding than helicopter. Maybe I was just making mountains out of a mole-hill this time.

The Clintons' lies about plagiarism were debunked yesterday.

1. Obama proposed the green jobs thing a month before Hillary in October 2007.

2. The idea for the Infrastructure Bank was not hers. She merely co-sponsored (cheered on) the bill proposed by Dodd.

I am beginning to wish HRC were a better candidate so that she would spend some time actually trying to persuade people that she is the choice rather than lying and racebaiting. She is a pathetic disgrace.

Allegra:

Thank you for amplifying my point!

Woo hoo! Nice flame war, and not a single concern troll about who will lend money to the poor folk if Obama starts regulating their credit card agreements!

I'm so proud.

Is Hillary still trying to take credit for SCHIP? On Warren Olney's show today it was all about Obama, and one of the guests was Joel Stein's mom. (Yes, it was a little goofy. Stein was also on.) She's not a Clinton surrogate by any means, so I'm not claiming this is coming from the campaign, but as the anti-Obama counterpoint in the show she was touting Clinton's success in "bringing health care to poor children ..." among other claimed successes (most of which dated from the first lady days). Wasn't that SCHIP claim debunked?

Considering he has sucked up to the financial industry (See Harper's Magazine article by Ken Silverstein, November 2006), I am glad Obama this week is finally getting back to some populist rhetoric, at least. May we hope he may actually stand up for regular working class Americans if he were to attain the presidency?

This point has been substantively addressed above, but no one made the obvious response to right's "Wouldn't it be easier to just teach people how to do math so they can figure out how much debt they can afford?"

You have obviously never taught math to anyone, or at least not to anyone as innumerate as the average American. Ideally more rational: yes. Ideally more efficient: yes. Ideally more beneficial: yes. It would also be easier if the poor could just eat cake instead of starving. But out here in the real world, "easier" belongs nowhere near "teaching people how to do math". Especially if they're the kind of people who will borrow money to buy nice clothes, meals out, etc. Obviously some people get in CC debt because otherwise they would starve, lose their home, etc., but those people aren't really in a position to calculate how much debt they can afford or to benefit from minor tweaks in our CC system, are they?

In response to the original post, these tweaks would probably do next-to-nothing for most people. CC companies will always find ways to make money off those who don't pay their balances - the existing fee structure is very carefully designed to ensure that the company consistently takes in enough to cover expenses and take a reliable profit, and if the companies are forced to lower some fees and rates they will raise others. If we did something effective like put an actual cap on effective interest rate:

(dollars owed) must be less than (dollars borrowed)* (1.xx)^years owed

CC companies would simply stop lending to people to whom it was not profitable to lend on these terms (no I'm not a concern troll - in fact, this would probably be good for the poor - but they wouldn't like it). Even if the formula were this simple, border-line credit-worthy people would still charge too much, carry balances, and pay the maximum. Those who don't understand the flaws of high-interest rate long-term debt for the purchase of nondurable goods are hopeless.

Matt,

Do you really think that the return on assets is going to drop for credit card companies after these rules are imposed? Or do you think it is more likely that credit card companies will increase overall rates to maintain their rate of return? Or possibly be more stringent in reviewing credit card applications so that people with shakier credit history are excluded?

If you argue that credit card companies will suffer a drop in rate of return after these rules are imposed, you need to show why the credit card industry is monopolistic and these companies are currently getting an above average return for the risks that they are taking.

What drives me crazy about government by regulation is that people think regulations are cost free and there will only be benefits. It would be nice if Matt would think a little more (or ask Megan).

"Interesting proposals on credit card regulations. But they nibble at the edge. If he were proposing a ceiling on interest rates of, say, 12 percent (or whatever percent over prime that works out to today), that would be really interesting."

Yeah, and the end of credit cards are they are currently offered. That might not be a bad thing, but just understand that a large source of credit currently available at one price would dry up if you impose a price ceiling.

Again, maybe a good thing. But the follow-on effects would likely include lower consumer spending in the short term. That brings lower economic growth, less employment, etc. in the short term. Stack a few more regulatory proposals like that together, and you are wondering why unemployment hovers at 7% and 1% GDP growth is all you can get in 2011-12.

Me, I'd probably support a 12% cap on interest. But I understand that policies like that carry a cost too.

I'm one of the people who's been suspicious of BO's lack of specifics, so I'm happy to see this set of policies--sort of! Because they exist in a vacuum that completely ignores the legislative reality on this issue (and which I think Matt must have forgotten): these policies could never pass the senate, even if it had 60 Democrats, because the CC companies, a little like the military, have spread themselves around the country and made themselves immune to most political pressure.

They're heavily concentrated in Delaware, the Dakotas, other states with Dem senators: all of whom voted for the new bankruptcy policy, one of the most regressive pieces of legislation of the last 20 years (see Elizabeth Warren of Harvard on this fiasco).

There was a hearing, I think in the House Banking Committee, about six months ago, where the legislators did their Senator Foghorn bit about outrageous fees and all the rest, and the slick bankers made some ritual apologies, and then we all went back to business as usual.

This is an interesting test case, though, and suggests to me again that Obaman change is likely to be a pipe dream: forget about reaching out to "moderate Republicans" to "change the rules of Washington"--all 4 of the moderate Republicans that are left--who's going to reach the two Senators Nelson, and Carper, Conrad and Baucus? And Landrieu and Pryor and Feinstein?

Man, I sure don't see that crew voting for a whole new way of doing business....

It's Janesville.

What, are you sexist or something?

(Also, note that many commenters go back and correct their typos. Why doesn't the original post writer?)

Obama's National Infrastructure Bank also has interesting historical president: Alexander Hamilton's National Bank. Hamilton, who is often a hero of conservatives, actually had a fairly "left" conception of liberal capitalism where the state would play a significant role as an economic engine by investing public funds in infrastructure and other public goods. Obama, and the Democratic Party, would do well to link themselves to this tradition, given how the Founders are a sacred cow in American politics.

There are other compelling ways to link liberal policies to the ideas of the Founders: Jefferson's plan for the virginia school system; Washington's plan for a national university; Madison's invectives against a constant state of war as undermining democracy as a critique of the war on terror, etc. Framing left liberal politics as the politics of the Constitutional framers gives liberalism an historical credibility that appeals to moderate conservatives. And the talking points constructed by political consultants pale in comparison to the graceful, moral terms in which the Founders justified their arguments for these left liberal agendas.

So, I feel a little trepidation at wading into a Clinton-Obama flamewar, but only poster Will Allen asked, in passing, the question that comes to mind when I read that Obama has announced that credit card banks are now in his sights.

If Obama is so bothered by consumer debt abuse by the banks, why oh why did he vote for the bankruptcy demolition bill just as soon as he reached the Senate? Anybody hear him make a convincing case why he had to vote "Aye"? 'Cause I sure didn't. Seems to me to be a case of flip-flopping of the worst kind: demanding changes to situations to which he himself powerfully contributed.

Obama’s efforts to connect to the Republican Party, specifically Bush, and Dick Chaney, of the Halliburton Company, dates back to the Presidents Grandfather, Prescott Bush, and indeed Chaney was once an executive officer of Halliburton.

The American military pounds Iraq with Artillary, bombs, and the like, destroying large sections of cities, and infra-structures, then Halliburton comes in to rebuild. Halliburton and Halliburton associated companies have raked in ten’s of billions.

Obama is just like the BIG HALIBURTAN. Haliburton has contracted to build detention centers in the U.S. similiar to the one in Quantanammo Bay, Cuba. Halliburton does nothing to earn the Two Dollars for each meal an American Serviceman in Iraq eats.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/ 2...ain636644.shtml

Halliburton was scheduled to take control of the Dubai Ports in The United Arab Emiirate. The deal was canceled when Bush was unable to affect the transfer of the American Ports.

Now we see what some might suspect as similiar financial escapading from the Democrats.

Two years ago, Iraq’s Ministry of Electricity gave a $50 million contract to a start-up security company - Companion- owned by now-indicted businessman (TONY REZKO) Tony Rezko and a onetime Chicago cop, Daniel T. Frawley, to train Iraqi power-plant guards in the United States. An Iraqi leadership change left the deal in limbo. Now the company, Companion Security, is working to revive its contract.
Involved along with Antoin “Tony” Rezco, long time friend and neighbor of Democratic Presidential hopeful Barack Obama, and former cop Daniel T. Frawley, is Aiham Alsammarae. Alsammarae was accused of financial corruption by Iraqi authorities and jailed in Iraq last year before escaping and returning here.

Obama should be vetted and disclose his connection to the criminal money generating underworld. Besides, his connections to the REZCO MAFIA types, his up-coming tax fraud charges — Obama needs to disclose why he is a MUSLIM and stop suppoting our intervention in IRAQ. It’s time to shove an introduction to this fake rip-off Obama and invite the thief pipsqueke to meet the Pigeon Creek Police Department.

Thank you for putting this information in one place. It is so discouraging to realize that a bargainer is fooling the good people of America. It happened when President Bush was put into office, and now it is happening again. Why don't American's think before they act--instead of relying on emotions.

Here we go again, blah blah blah! Who really cares about us, the middle class? Change! YEAH RIGHT! The saga continues.... This is one of, if not the most important election in history. The future, and the well being of the United States of America is at stake, lets get it right.

PS if you cant beat em' join em' lets get together and start a CC company!

Obama’s efforts to connect to the Republican Party, specifically Bush, and Dick Chaney, of the Halliburton Company, dates back to the Presidents Grandfather, Prescott Bush, and indeed Chaney was once an executive officer of Halliburton.

The American military pounds Iraq with Artillary, bombs, and the like, destroying large sections of cities, and infra-structures, then Halliburton comes in to rebuild. Halliburton and Halliburton associated companies have raked in ten’s of billions.

Obama is just like the BIG HALIBURTAN. Haliburton has contracted to build detention centers in the U.S. similiar to the one in Quantanammo Bay, Cuba. Halliburton does nothing to earn the Two Dollars for each meal an American Serviceman in Iraq eats.

http://www.halliburtonwatch.org/

Halliburton was scheduled to take control of the Dubai Ports in The United Arab Emiirate. The deal was canceled when Bush was unable to affect the transfer of the American Ports.

Now we see what some might suspect as similiar financial escapading from the Democrats.

Two years ago, Iraq’s Ministry of Electricity gave a $50 million contract to a start-up security company - Companion- owned by now-indicted businessman (TONY REZKO) Tony Rezko and a onetime Chicago cop, Daniel T. Frawley, to train Iraqi power-plant guards in the United States. An Iraqi leadership change left the deal in limbo. Now the company, Companion Security, is working to revive its contract.
Involved along with Antoin “Tony” Rezco, long time friend and neighbor of Democratic Presidential hopeful Barack Obama, and former cop Daniel T. Frawley, is Aiham Alsammarae. Alsammarae was accused of financial corruption by Iraqi authorities and jailed in Iraq last year before escaping and returning here.

LIKE FATHER LIKE SON --
Obama should be vetted and disclose his connection to the criminal money generating underworld. Besides, his connections to the REZCO MAFIA types, his up-coming tax fraud charges — Obama needs to disclose why he is a MUSLIM and stop suppoting our intervention in IRAQ. It’s time to introduce this false, fake Xerox - X box Obama and invite the self-indicting thief plagiarizing pipsqueke Xerox - X box to meet the Crooked Creek Police Department Crooked Creek.

Watch Zeitgeist! We need help!

MESSAGE

MESSAGE

MESSAGE

MESSAGE


Comments closed February 28, 2008.

Copyright © 2008 by The Atlantic Monthly Group. All rights reserved.