Ross and I recorded a podcast about Obama's big speech. Enjoy:
This is probably not my finest work, since I'm still ailing and possibly not thinking/speaking clearly.
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Speech Podcast
20 Mar 2008 08:24 am
Comments (17)
Yeah, we heard you the first time you posted that Fred. You don't need to put it in EVERY thread, you know.
As a Clinton supporter I can still recognize that her path to the nomination is a very narrow one. Although, it is somewhat less narrow since the Wright controversy.
If the grownups in the Democratic party had any courage they would stand up to the activists, affluent liberals and enthusiastic youth and tell them the party cannot afford to nominate Obama, who is probably now unelectable.
This a new poll, Ryan. The previous one was from Zogby; this one is from Gallop. Saw it for the first time this morning on Yahoo!. Don't hate the messenger.
Ross's approach is maddening to me. And so is Matthew's, simply because he's not approaching Obama's defense in exactly the way I'd like to hear him. Basically, Ross, I think Obama obviously IS challenging politics-as-usual by asking people not to angrily tick off the "scandal" box when they hear things said by Rev. Jeremiah Wright while preaching.
I'm not saying any particular person is judging from anger. But taken together, we must all work ever harder to keep the temperature down.
By choosing Wright as his pastor, he is staying connected with big parts of the the Black community. This challenges us, you and me; no discomfort, no challenge. Similarly, a conservative stays in touch with big parts of the white community by associating with various wingnuts; white privilege allows these connections to be smoothed. By the way, tallying up the ridiculous and conspiracy-minded things said in the various churches on the various "sides" is probably not going to reflect well on anyone. These are folks who all choose to get up there and rant at least a little about spaghetti monsters. (If Ross's criteria is that the Preacher should be inoffensive, why does he leave Reason from his list of victims worthy of respect!? I'm just kidding.)
The point about Obama acting as if Trinity Church wouldn't be a big deal... well, that's an important part of what Presidents do. They shouldn't do it too much, but in each instance when something does indeed become a problem, what's called for is an excellent dialogue with America that adds context for everyone, based in reality and our understanding. I know, it's a challenge.
So. The question is: does the preacher preach hate? No! His rhetoric is unfortunate, in that it causes a lot of friction. (And that's also useful.) Listen to what Wright's really talking about, in every clip I've heard so far, and it's peace and love wrapped in wrath. EVERY authentic Christian gives you that. Fox News doesn't like to play the whole "G.D. America!" clip, I assume because it's all about social justice and rather biblical-sounding.
Obama's distinct gift is to spread the circle of light -- and here I mean the disinfecting light of public discourse -- wider. To include a little more of the parts of what we do that we do out of anger. Peacefully. This is, by far, the most important aspect of what's going on now. So much of the rest is "shock of the new" because his loony uncle is different than the loony-ass uncles we've become too used to. McCain's loony uncle is, in part, not so distinct from Muslim crazies who also want a conflagration. Deal. (I thought Samuel L. Jackson fixed this glitch.)
It was a good speech. Kudos on transforming a challenge into an opportunity -- not just for his campaign, but for our political discourse more generally.
Re: Ross's remark that it wasn't "the best speech ever in American politics." Well, I don't know what the best speech ever would be -- and obviously neither does Ross. But I will note that immediately after Washington delivered his famous farewell address, the Delaware Courier & Tribune had this to say:
"While Mr. Wafhington's speech was no doubt effective, we believe that his supporters have been exceffively tranfported in their enthufiaftic praise. It was a workmanlike piece of rhetoric that served his immediate political purpofes, but it was not the beft speech ever in American politics!"
No prophet is honored in his own decade.
So according to Ross Douthat, Obamaniacs have to face the reality that their candidate is only ALMOST as good as George Washington. Harsh!
But seriously, the ludicrous sense of racial/cultural entitlement Douthat exudes in pontificating on why Barack Obama should have fled Trinity Church with a cross, a silver bullet, and a garlic clove in his hand is unbearable. And not withstanding his disclaimers, he seems to have no sense or feel for the texture and temperature of urban black life. Now, I happen to have grown up in the kind of rural white communities that form John McCain's bedrock base: Where's Douthat's sense of outrage about all the lunatic asshole tics of that culture--black helicopters, secret NAFTA highways, jackbooted U.S. Govt. thugs, and so on (talk about Anti-American!), viz. the views of assorted grand panjandrums of the evangelical movement who have had the GOP in a death grip for 25 years? As Matt points out, while no one seriously and in good faith believes that Obama affirms even one tenet of Jeremiah Wright's most controversial rants, it's quite clear that John McCain's worldview is frighteningly compatible and useful in relation to the nuttiest rapture eschatology of the fanatical religious base--and he went to Jerry Falwell's university to affirm that reality and kiss the ring.
It's awfully late in the day to be engaging in all these mincing parsings and sophistries and looking past the central dangers and challenges of our historical moment. Look, I can see that Matt is palsy-walsy with this claque of wonks, necessarily including all his LAME colleagues at theatlantic.com. But let me be the first to say: Ross Douthat is a friggin' douchebag. He's fully the equal of Megan McArdle in that regard.
And this podcast sounds like The Onion riffing on this subculture. Matt, why waste your time with this kind of wankery?
I wonder if any blacks find it a tad condescending when white liberals buy Obama's line that the conspiracy theories and racial divisiveness preached at his church are, essentially, "a black thing, you wouldn't understand". Do you really think all black churches are like this? Do you think Colin Powell goes to a church like this? What about Bill Cosby, or Ken Chenault? What about the middle class black professionals in D.C. who Matt doesn't hang out with?
What Obama can't back away from is that he deliberately chose a radical, divisive church 20 years ago, whether because he actually believes in its radicalism or because he thought it would give him the biggest boost in local politics.
He should have just stayed Muslim.
On condescension, Juan: Check out the beam in thine own eye, beeatch. You know nothing about my experience besides what I just noted about my early life. But if you honestly can't deal with the fact of Barack Obama sitting in Trinity Church through Wright's wrath, then you are really just ignorant of the realities of racial division in this country today--like all too many of these privileged, judgmental (mostly white) pundits who can't wait even one second to slag Obama by association. Just ignant!
Step off, elle loco: Your problems ain't gots nothin' to do with me. Maybe you angry 'cause your hair got wet, or maybe your man be on the D.L. and done gave you the HIV.
Thanks for showing your true colors, Juan. QED. Stay classy and nonracist and all.
So, another way of going at the question is, where IS Bill Cosby? Where are all the fine, high-minded, unself-condescending Talented Tenthers leaping up to disown Jeremiah Wright and Barack Obama, to reject and denounce what has gone on in the Trinity Church? The only black commentators I see sticking the shiv in Obama over this are on the payroll of the Great Noise Machine.
Well, y'know, Matt, I, y'know, think that what you, y'know, had to say made, y'know, a lot of good, y'know, sense. Mut maybe you should, y'know, consider sticking to, y'know, print.
Elle Loco,
I don't think you're giving Ross enough credit here. He was pretty scathing on the rEVOLution's nonsense, and if you read his blog, you'll notice that he is exalting Obama's speech with faint criticism deliberately. This was an exceedingly important speech, and Ross has said so plainly.
"But if you honestly can't deal with the fact of Barack Obama sitting in Trinity Church through Wright's wrath, then you are really just ignorant of the realities of racial division in this country today."
This is very likely true of me. Before I saw the transcripts, I would never have believed that Obama's pastor might be that deep in the conspiracy swamp. That level of ignorance does not speak well of me.
But you must note that a portion of my support for Obama was also founded in ignorance. I still support him, but this was a blow to my faith. Wright's statements are quite ugly, and the fact that I was unfamiliar with this nasty undercurrent in the Black community doesn't make them any more excusable.
If the grownups in the Democratic party had any courage they would stand up to the activists, affluent liberals and enthusiastic youth and tell them the party cannot afford to nominate Obama, who is probably now unelectable.
First...there are no grownups in the U.S. government, sans a few rebels.
Second...the Dems should have the courage, I agree, to stand up and support the voters. If they did, however, Obama would be the nominee.
Third...all politicians want to get re-elected, let's face it. Thus, whomever is ahead in pledged delegates and popular vote will win the Dem nomination. Period.
Ann Coulter's take on Obama's speech is worth reading because, although politically incorrect, I suspect it's closer to the reaction a lot of non-pundits and non-Obamatons had. Obama's recent drop in the polls, despite the speech, suggests as much. Read the whole thing, but here is an excerpt:
Obama tried to justify Wright's deranged rants by explaining that "legalized discrimination" is the "reality in which Rev. Wright and other African-Americans of his generation grew up." He said that a "lack of economic opportunity among black men, and the shame and frustration that came from not being able to provide for one's family, contributed to the erosion of black families."
That may accurately describe the libretto of "Porgy and Bess," but it has no connection to reality. By Rev. Wright's own account, he was 12 years old and was attending an integrated school in Philadelphia when Brown v. Board of Education was announced, ending "separate but equal" schooling...
See also Krauthammer's take. Excerpt:
This contextual analysis of Wright's venom, this extenuation of black hate speech as a product of white racism, is not new. It's the Jesse Jackson politics of racial grievance, expressed in Ivy League diction and Harvard Law nuance. That's why the speech made so many liberal commentators swoon: It bathed them in racial guilt, while flattering their intellectual pretensions. An unbeatable combination.
when Brown v. Board of Education was announced, ending "separate but equal" schooling
We know who Coulter's audience is now: people dumb enough to fall for that.
Comments closed April 03, 2008.
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Heads in the Sand
Let's see if there's a lag effect from Obama's speech, because the latest Gallup poll has Clinton leading him 49% to 42%: " Clinton takes lead over Obama in Gallup poll"
Posted by Fred | March 20, 2008 8:58 AM