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Iraq and the Candidates

21 May 2008 08:19 am

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Jon Chait has an interesting article arguing that we shouldn't take the candidates rhetoric about forward-looking Iraq policy all that seriously -- both have incentives to try to outline crystal clear positions but, in reality, both would need to respond to some extent to events on the ground.

That's all very true, but at the same time I think we're in danger of seeing a tendency toward the smart set actually underestimating the extent of disagreement between Obama and McCain. Part of this is much is being made of the fact that some public statements by some Obama advisors seem to indicate that they are less enthusiastic about speedy withdrawal from Iraq than the candidate's stated vision seems to imply. A big deal gets made out of this because it's a newsworthy admission against interest type of thing. A less big deal gets made out of the fact that there are actually a lot of other people associated with the Obama camp who completely agree with Obama's rhetoric on Iraq. Something like "Obama Advisor Agrees With Obama Position" makes for a terrible article so you get less coverage of the fact that Obama really might just listen to Brian Katulis and Larry Korb and leave Iraq.

More broadly, though, Jon's article has been given the unfortunate subhead "Ignore what candidates say about foreign policy" even though that's not what the argument of the column says. But of course "foreign policy" is not equivalent to "ideas about appropriate force levels in Iraq in October of 2009." Foreign policy includes our relationships with Russia, China, India, Japan and the European allies. It includes our approach to Syria and North Korea. It certainly includes our approach to, say, Iran and it's clear enough that McCain and Obama have different ideas about Iran. But the course of U.S.-Iranian relations will have a big impact on America's Iraq policy. The causal line here isn't totally predictable -- Obama's Iraq policy will depend, in part, on the outcome of his efforts at diplomacy with Iran, but we can't know what that outcome will be. On the one hand, that supports Jon's point that there's a lot of uncertainty here. But at the same time, there are meaningful differences -- Obama might work out a good accommodation with Iran but McCain almost certainly won't, whereas McCain might blunder into a larger war with Iran while Obama almost certainly won't.

U.S. Air Force photo by Tech. Sgt. Jeffrey Allen

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Comments (9)

I suspect that the 'divisions' in the Obama camp are more reflective of the degree to which they consider rapid withdrawal practical and possible rather than desirable. There is also the issue of managing expectations, it may indeed be possible to have a withdrawal completed in 12 months, but they will want this presented as a heroic achievement, not a checkbox item.

The real question is what the candidates want from the Iraq situation.

McCain is clearly unwilling to accept responsibility for a military defeat. He may or may not consider establishing permanent bases in Iraq to provide control of the region as the ultimate objective of the exercise, but his administration would clearly act as if they were. Given his abject ignorance of the region, unable to distinguish Al Qaeda from Iran, it is unlikely that he has a wider perspective than occupation.

Obama does not have to accept responsibility for the defeat, the defeat was clearly due to the incompetence of Bush and crew. He certainly does not want permanent bases even if they are achievable. He certainly isn't interested in occupation for the sake of occupation.

The real difference between the candidates is their ability to face the facts. Obama knows that the situation in Iraq is lost. There is no possible outcome that is going to leave either Iraq or the US better than it started. There is no outcome that is not going to leave Iran with a vastly increased influence in the region. McCain just sticks his fingers in his ears and says 'la la la, I'm not listening".

In a situation where "there is no possible outcome that is going to leave either Iraq or the US better than it started," the last guy to admit that, wins.

Even if a candidates positions with respect to present conditions will be irrelevent next January, those positions still shed light on how they would deal with future situations. Even a political opportunist like McCain doesn't completely reinvent himself every six months.

Why is there this sentiment that it's somehow "unrealistic" to withdraw from Iraq too quickly? You hear this all the time, that Obama's withdrawal promises will "hit the wall of reality" when he gets into office and "responsibility demands" that we lengthen the timetable. But we're in Iraq because we want to be. What responsibilities are keeping us there?

I understand this sort of hazy misdirection coming from a war supporter who, in fact, desires to stay in Iraq as a matter of policy and this sort of rhetoric is a politically useful guise. But many ostensible withdrawalists take this line too, and in addition to being wrong it's unhelpful to the policy.

Perhaps Obama is like John Kennedy in this respect. Many of Kennedy's *domestic* policy advisors had "dovish" views on foreign policy. But more important was that his foreign policy advisors were mostly "hawks."

I second Njorl's point. Unexpected events are indeed likely to occur, but how the candidates have reacted to events in the past and present are the best evidence we have about how they will react to those future events.

Cut to one important question. Who do you trust more in the handling of Iraq, Iran, and general Middle East affairs?

I don't have a lot of faith in John "Bomb, Bomb, Bomb ... Bomb, Bomb Iran" McCain. Anybody who needs Joe Lieberman as their foreign policy wingman isn't qualified.

Matt: "But at the same time, there are meaningful differences -- Obama might work out a good accommodation with Iran but McCain almost certainly won't, whereas McCain might blunder into a larger war with Iran while Obama almost certainly won't."

Based on what evidence, Matt?

Obama has said Iran is a "threat". Obama is for more aggressive sanctions to force Iran to stop enrichment, even though Iran cannot and will not do so.

Obama therefore believes Iran has a nuclear weapons program and must be stopped.

The only difference between this approach and McCain is that McCain won't bother with diplomacy and simply attack Iran. Obama will futz around with what he CALLS "diplomacy" for a year or two, and then be left exactly where we are now - the option to bomb.

The only way he might get past that is to offer Iran a "grand bargain" with security guarantees, support for Iran's nuclear energy program, and diplomatic recognition.

The odds of Obama doing that against the AIPAC crowd is just about nil.

Besides which, if Bush and Cheney start an Iran war before the election or before Obama takes office - even assuming Obama can WIN against McCain if an Iran war starts - how do you think Obama is going to be able to handle an already expanded war in Iran?

Of course, I know you can't talk about ANY of that, Matt, so this is just rhetorical.

Grow some balls, Matt.

Just to add to that, it's truly pathetic that you are sitting there sweating whether Bush is going to attack Iran. I mean, the only way you can get out of this thing is to make a statement.

Bush and Cheney are going to attack Iran within the next six months. So you've got six months to stake out the correct side on this. Sitting there like a ballless wonder hoping Bush won't attack Iran, so it will all blow over, and you can continue to look like a genuine pundit, is just pathetic.

Compared to Bill Kristol, who is ALWAYS wrong and proud of it, you're just a wannabe.

But apparently you think that when Bush attacks Iran, you can come out and say, "Well, the war is wrong, but Iran probably was proliferating, so the war was inevitable". That isn't going to cut it when the war goes really badly - as it will.

You're truly an intellectual coward like your mentor, Josh Marshall.


Comments closed June 04, 2008.

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