I hadn't thought of this, but it makes sense. Jackie Calmes reports for the WSJ: "Some in the Clinton camp also noted a possible problem for a party-unity ticket: Bill Clinton may balk at releasing records of his business dealings and big donors to his presidential library." You have to assume the Obama campaign wouldn't agree to an Obama-Clinton without without at least their own vetting team getting a crack at those books. And it seems very unlikely that Obama would want to fight Bill's battle for non-disclosure to the public.
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Obstacles to Unity
05 Jun 2008 08:43 am
Comments (28)
Why would Clinton lovers want to share the same ticket as second fiddle to someone so manifestly unfit to be Commander in Chief anyway? Shouldn't they just vote for McCain?
So that we can all be safe, I mean.
I agree with Bill (above). In the end, I doubt Hillary Clinton really wants to be a vice president. I'm sure that after she has had a chance to take a break, de-pressurize and get her head together, she will begin to think of all sorts of more valuable ways of spending her time than sitting around as Barack Obama's understudy and gaveling Senate meetings.
I suspect most of her supporters don't really want her to be a vice president either. The ones that think they do are just looking for some gesture of R.E.S.P.E.C.T., and being offered the VP slot is the only thing they can think of right now.
Anyway, this line of discussion needs to die, because it was never going to happen, and won't happen for at least a dozen great reasons. The best of those reasons is here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T2DECDKOFnw
Calculating the pros or cons of making Billary the VP is an insane waste of time. The last thing on earth Obama needs to do is make nice with these vile retreads. She is the single most revolting candidate in American history, and hubby is a syphlitic megalomaniac. Even going through the charade of offering them the spot is a lose-lose. Let Caroline Kennedy say: "While the Senator admires both Clintons tremendously, the campaign will be going in another direction. We wish them well." Then, a few days later, the campaign should announce that Senator Hagel is under serious consideration. Any dithering that fuels speculation about a "unity ticket" will do serious harm to the campaign. It's important now to nip that nightmare scenario in the bud.
Well, at least the necessity of full family financial disclosure makes a face-saving reason not to have her on the ticket. Doubley so, since the McCain family finances look to be among the issues that get batted around during the coming campaign (if not by Obama, at least by partisans).
Bill - I see that ad as a good sign for Democrats. The Republicans can't put any Republicans in their own ads because in this election voters can't stand Republicans.
So when is Mr. Yglesias and the other Israel bashers on this blog going to comment on Senator Osamas' prostrating himself before the AIPAC meeting yesterday? The good senator didn't get those brown lips from sucking doorknobs. What a suckup.
It's very sad but entirely expected, due to the undue influence of nuts like you over the party. That needs to change.
This terrible news...FOR HILLARY!
Wouldn't this have been a problem if Clinton had won the nomination? Could Bill have refused to release this information in that case? If she were the nominee, there would be tremendous pressure for him to make all of his business dealings public.
In the end, I doubt Hillary Clinton really wants to be a vice president. I'm sure that after she has had a chance to take a break, de-pressurize and get her head together, she will begin to think of all sorts of more valuable ways of spending her time than sitting around as Barack Obama's understudy and gaveling Senate meetings.
I agree, which is why the persistent rumors about her wanting the Vice Presidency make me nervous. Any politician as accustomed to power and influence as Hillary Clinton, who came as close to winning the nomination as she did, would only be satisfied as Vice President if he or she were given a large portfolio and free rein to lead on certain policies... maintaining message discipline would be completely impossible.
And having a former President that tantalizingly close to power in an administration run by a political rival, especially a former President who's not noted for keeping his mouth shut? That's just asking for trouble.
And this is not a personal slur against the character of Bill and Hillary. Whatever else you want to say about them -- they're human. I think human nature would make a mess of this arrangement in a hurry.
I think Obama would be smart to consider selecting a Clinton supporter for VP, and he should give serious consideration to selecting a woman. But he should not, under any circumstances, pick Hillary Clinton.
On AIPAC: I'd rather it wasn't a prerequisite for U.S. presidential candidates to kowtow to those people, but at least he did well. Still, hopefully when he runs for re-election he can ignore them.
Re Steve Labonne & TH
To be fair here, Senator Clinton and Senator McCain also sucked up pretty good themselves.
I think Obama would be smart to consider selecting a Clinton supporter for VP, and he should give serious consideration to selecting a woman. But he should not, under any circumstances, pick Hillary Clinton.
Rendell is starting to look intriguing to me.
I'm not really buying the "Bill Clinton would balk" argument. Isn't it likely that they have made preparations to provide this information in the case she became the nominee, anyway?
PSoTD- one of the bullets I believe we dodged is that no, I don't think they made any such preparations. I think that in true Clinton fashion they thought they'd be able to just brazen their way though it in the fall. (And I think they would have been very seriously mistaken about that.)
LaFollette Progressive has it right. Making Hillary his VP choice would be an insane move on Obama's part. His power and prestige would be thoroughly undermined throughout his administration. Speculation about who's really running the country would be rampant. It would make the sort of talk you hear now about Cheney seem like nothing. Plus, with HRC and her husband being such high-profile figures, Obama would always have to worry about new Clinton psuedo scandals popping up. Where's the upside?
I've always thought a Hillary/Obama ticket would have made sense. An Obama/Hillary ticket is madness.
Promise to nominate her to the Supreme Court. Allow her to help pick the VP. But don't, under any circumstances put her on the ticket.
Obama never really went after Hillary's negatives once it was clear he had the lead -- because he didn't want to trigger a violent civil war in the Democratic Party that would lose the general election.
But Hillary has HUGE negatives that the Republicans could exploit -- and which DISQUALIFY her to be Vice President.
Her support in the primaries was largely among low-info blue collar workers in Appalachia and Hispanics -- who would desert her in droves if told why Hillary supported the Iraq War.
Look ,for example, at Lincoln Chafee's recent book
"Against the Tide". Although a Republican, Chafee opposed the Iraq invasion.
From http://www.projo.com/news/content/LInc_Chafee_01-27-08_PD8NPTK_v102.182ab97.html
"The book excoriates Mr. Bush and his GOP allies who repeatedly fanned such wedge issues as changing the U.S. Constitution to ban gay marriage, abortion and flag-burning. But he saves some of his harshest words for Democrats who paved the way for Mr. Bush to use the U.S. military to invade Iraq. That includes New York Sen. Hillary Clinton, whom Chafee says put her presidential ambitions above standing up to Mr. Bush and the rush to war in Iraq.
“I find it surprising now, in 2008, how many Democrats are running for president after shirking their constitutional duty to check and balance this president,” writes Chafee. “Being wrong about sending Americans to kill and be killed, maim and be maimed, is not like making a punctuation mistake in a highway bill.
“They argue that the president duped them into war, but getting duped does not exactly recommend their leadership. Helping a rogue president start an unnecessary war should be a career-ending lapse of judgment.”
Chafee was the only Republican senator to vote against prosecuting the war. “The top Democrats were at their weakest when trying to show how tough they were,” writes Chafee. “They were afraid that Republicans would label them soft in the post-September 11 world, and when they acted in political self-interest, they helped the president send thousands of Americans and uncounted innocent Iraqis to their doom.
“Instead of talking tough or meekly raising one’s hand to support the tough talk, it is far more muscular, I think, to find out what is really happening in the world and have a debate about what we really need to accomplish,” writes Chafee. “That is the hard work of governing, but it was swept aside once the fear, the war rhetoric and the political conniving took over.”
Chafee writes of his surprise at “how quickly key Democrats crumbled.” Democratic senators, Chafee writes, “went down to the meetings at the White House and the Pentagon and came back to the chamber ready to salute. With wrinkled brows they gravely intoned that Saddam Hussein must be stopped. Stopped from what? They had no conviction or evidence of their own. They were just parroting the administration’s nonsense. They knew it could go terribly wrong; they also knew it could go terribly right. Which did they fear more?”
1) There is ONE other major faction which supports Hillary --the Professional Feminists and their ignorant supporters.
Who are indifferent to the thousands killed in Iraq by Senator Hillary's vote. And indifferent to the many thousands more who would be killed in Iran as Hillary tried to be "good for Israel".
2) The Professional Feminists are Indifferent to the Iraq War dead for two reasons:
Reason One is the FTTOM Rule: Fuck Them They're Only Men
Reason Two: The Professional Feminists know there is ZERO chance that their fat asses would ever be drafted and sent into combat.
3) But even though women don't serve in the combat units, there are many who serve in the military's support units. Some of those women have been killed by Hillary's self-serving vote. And thousands of mothers, of course, grieve for lost sons and daughters.
4) But Professional Feminists have always been happy to callously sell other women down the river. For the Cause.
Re Don Williams
No surprising that Mr. Williams likes Lincoln Chaffee, one of the most egregious Israel bashers in the Senate until his defeat in 2006 (which I'm sure Mr. Williams will blame on AIPAC).
Don Williams sure has the number on those "professional feminists". Everyone who ever supported the candidate he doesn't like must be profoundly ignorant--shoeless rubes, wetbacks, and stupid women. I love that message of unity. Are there any other people you'd like to insult today, Don Williams?
They were talking about this last night on Olbermann's show. Howard Fineman (yeah, I know) was saying this was a deal-breaker: Obama's people were insisting on disclosure, and HRC wants to protect Bill (as usual). Hopefully this will put an end to the Clinton VP nonsense.
Re Rob Mac's comment " Are there any other people you'd like to insult today, Don Williams?"
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Well, you left out the Israel Lobby.
And if you know of any other factions who enjoy the benefits of this country -- but who advance their political objectives by KILLING their fellow citizens with treacherous, self-serving , MALIGNANT behavior, then yes -- I'd like to insult those people too.
I'm not sure what Hillary Clinton wants, but it looks certain that Bill Clinton does want Hillary to be Obama's VP. I assume the heartbeat away part is the attraction. I personally think Obama would be crazy to select her, but the pressure will be enormous. Anyway, my favorite is Bob Graham.
"Any politician as accustomed to power and influence as Hillary Clinton, who came as close to winning the nomination as she did, would only be satisfied as Vice President if he or she were given a large portfolio and free rein to lead on certain policies... maintaining message discipline would be completely impossible.
And having a former President that tantalizingly close to power in an administration run by a political rival, especially a former President who's not noted for keeping his mouth shut? That's just asking for trouble."
And for all those reasons, this is precisely why Hillary is going to TRY to be Vice President.
Anybody who thinks the Clinton campaign is "over" is deluding themselves.
Watch this:
Jon Stewart Mocks "Hillary Is Inevitable" Punditry
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/06/05/jon-stewart-mocks-hillary_n_105386.html
Watch all the "I want" statements from Hillary. It IS all about HER.
"Promise to nominate her to the Supreme Court. Allow her to help pick the VP. But don't, under any circumstances put her on the ticket.
Posted by Rob Mac | June 5, 2008 11:05 AM"
Making public that he would nominate her for the Supreme Court would be an even better way of raising GOP turnout than making her VP because that would mean that she would have a permanent position of power, which would just drive the GOP crazy. Having her help vet the VP and then having her publicly come out in favor of the VP pick, especially if that pick is a woman, is probably better.
Comments closed June 19, 2008.
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Heads in the Sand
This will not calm the clintonlovers. According to Willie Brown on MSNBC last night, if Obama were serious about Hill, he could "work something out" about these disclosures which are "not really that big a deal".
Posted by jay | June 5, 2008 9:03 AM