« War is Peace | Main | Obama and the Progressive Economy » Smoking to Victory17 Jun 2008 03:21 pm Noting that smoking has become a rather class-bound phenomenon, Tony Horwitz suggests that Barack Obama could try to court working-class voters by abandoning his efforts to quit: "Added bonus — Virginia and North Carolina, two leading tobacco-producing states, are both in play this election." Note that several of America's greatest recent fictional presidents, including Jed Bartlett and Jeff Bridges' character in The Contender, secretly smoke. Comments (65)
I can't help but think of murderers, thieves, rapists and practitioners of bestiality when I see a smoker. They really are the most reprehensible class of humans, committing slow suicide instead of doing us all a favor and putting a gun in their mouth. Our hospitals have more pressing tasks than attempting futile extensions of their miserable lives. Deny them health insurance, life insurance, employment, housing and food. Make it unwelcome enough here and maybe they'll leave. 
Fuck you too, Mr. Duncan.
Steve, I'm getting mixed signals. How do you really feel about smokers?
Rob Long had this idea last year. I wonder how bad the blowback from the elite media would be--setting a bad example for your children and all that.
Yes, but those fictional characters "secretly" smoked, as you pointed out. So if Obama smokes in secret...this would help him in VA and NC how? He'd have to overtly smoke, maybe smoke while being introduced before a speech and then stub it out before he talked. Throw in some hacking coughs and yellowing teeth and he's set.
Steve: Given that you're a bone smoker, don't you feel as though your post was just a bit hypocritical?
Steve, you may want to redirect some of that zany-brained, red-faced craziness towards the purveyors of cigarettes, rather than those struggling with addiction. Keep in mind that many people are hooked as teenagers. I know when I started smoking at 14, it was for a fully-formed logical reason. Oh wait, I did it to piss off my mom. Took me until January 1 of this year to finally kick it. Who knows how much money I spent on that little rebellion.
Clinton was into cigars. Just sayin'
Steve Duncan is nothing more than a self-righteous bully. I don't smoke, and I don't entirely understand the appeal of breathing the fumes of a burning leaf into one's lungs, but only a dangerous asshole reacts to smoking the way Mr. Duncan has. His type have given us the War on Drugs, and any number of other foolhardy messianic (read: idiotic) attempts to foist someone's sense of self-superiority over everyone else. Please masturbate on your greatness in the privacy of your home, Steve; we want nothing to do with it.
Keep eating those cheeseburgers, Steve. "Extra bacon for me, please! Mrgrgrhfgffgrrh..."
Smoking again would also probably help Obama get the 15 year old rebel vote.
Jed Bartlett was a great president? What did he ever accomplish?
Obama should wait until after the election to quit. Less stress. I've never smoked, probably b/c I was the wheezing, asthmatic kid growing up. All I know is that after the puritans like Steve Duncan make smoking illegal, they'll come after alcohol. He's the righteous type that give liberals a bad name.
It's just that they make me so angry!
Addiction is such a piss poor excuse for continuing to smoke it barely rises to meriting refutation. However, here goes: Just fucking quit. Don't pick one up and light it. If you're willing to concede a dangerous chemical you willingly ingest is capable of controlling your voluntary actions you're too dangerous to roam free with the rest of the population. You've become the very definition of unsafe. You once never smoked, then decided to smoke. Now do the opposite. See? Easy. What, someone MADE you buy them? An invisible guiding hand opened the pack, lifted one to your lips and lit it, all while you strenuously resisted? Pathetic, weak minded fools. A perfectly good heart and clean lungs yet you actively seek cancer, emphysema and heart disease. Again, just find a pistol and end it all now. It'll only get uglier for you and your loved ones later.
Other Things Obama can do to assure victory: 1) Toke to victory - would relax his image.
I think it'd be way cooler to be caught smoking out back with the Secret Service guys than to make a big show of it.
The amazing thing is that with all of the critical issues facing the next president, smoking a cigarette every now and then really is something that might impress some people and sway their vote.
Don't forget secret-smoker Laura Bush! That worked out for them...
Additional fictional president that secretly smoked- Jack Ryan from the Tom Clancy novels.
Some are addicted to cigarettes, some are addicted to rage. I'm pretty sure a rageoholic like Steve is more dangerous on the loose than people slowly poisoning themselves.
Peter K., another sickly asthmatic kid who never smoked here. Interestingly, every time a cock like Steve Duncan posts on the EVILS of smoking, I'm half tempted to buy a pack of Marlboros and light one up. Half to see what it would be like, half to know, deep in my little black heart, that someone would be deeply, incredibly pissed off about it. I don't do it, because I'm a grown-up and I like breathing, but still.
So Persia, a couple more posts and you too will smell like an ashtray?
Nicotine was half of what fueled the fucking enlightenment (the other half being caffeine), so fuck all you dark ages worshopping motherfuckers, doubly so for steve duncan. I bet you rail against starbucks too.
I think Chunkin' Steve Duncan is just trying to get a rise out of you, fellas. No one is actually that enraged over someone smoking in one's spare time - if I want to eat a hunk of cheese, smoke a cigarette, down a shot of rye, wash my bathroom with bleach and take a big whiff while I'm in there, then cover myself in DDT bug spray before going outside, who cares what anyone says even though none of these things are good for me. If it ticks someone off, that person is just looking for an excuse to get ticked off - it shouldn't actually be personally offensive to them (with the possible exception of smoking in a crowded place where non-smokers wouldn't expect to be hit up with smoke, like if Chunkin' lit up a cigar next to me at a ball game or something...)
Ever had a really good hand-rolled cigarette together with a really good cup of coffee and a really good piece of chocolate? Man.
steve, I have no real addictive reaction to nicotine, but the occasional cigar and party cigarette is pretty nice. I judge addicts who smell like smoke and can't sit down for a dinner with friends without getting up for a smoke break on their own terms, as disgusting individuals. I don't tar (no pun intended) everyone who's ever lit up a tobacco product with the same brush.
I've stayed off smokes now for 11 years, promising myself I'll take it back up when I retire. (I figure smelling like an ashtray won't be as much of liability if I don't have to head into the office in the morning.) I totally agree that the best thing Obama could do for his campaign would be to get "caught" smoking out back with a member or two of his Secret Service detail. When he apologized (for the children's sake, of course), we liberal scolds would of course forgive his recidivism; and blue-collar smokers would know he didn't mean it and maybe feel a little more like he was one of them.
Addiction is such a piss poor excuse for continuing to smoke it barely rises to meriting refutation. Spoken like a person truly unfamiliar with addiction. I've been watching my father repeatedly try to quit throughout my life, and let me tell you a little bit about what that's like, Stevebag. You turn into a raging asshole for days on end (you might know how that feels, I'd guess). You snap at the slightest thing and constantly have headaches. Then, something stresses you out, and you find yourself faced with a choice between lighting one up, or going unhinged and maybe burning some bridges that aren't easily repaired. Moral of the story: if you don't know what you're talking about, shut your mouth.
It's amazing the stupid things that infuriate people like Steve. Especially when those same people feel completely righteous buying alcohol, driving around in gas-guzzling SUVs, and otherwise not caring about anyone else around them. I would think that this class of people (those with little compassion for others and who wish ill fortune and violence upon others) are truly the most reprehensible class of humans...as Steve puts it.
Steve, I haven't smoked in a moth, but reading your self-righteous tirade is making me want to pick up a pack. Have you ever successfully convinced anyone to do anything, ever?
It's amazing the stupid things that infuriate people like Steve. Especially when those same people feel completely righteous buying alcohol, driving around in gas-guzzling SUVs, and otherwise not caring about anyone else around them. I would think that this class of people (those with little compassion for others and who wish ill fortune and violence upon others) are truly the most reprehensible class of humans...as Steve puts it. I'm gonna go have a smoke :)
Hey, Steve, you forgot one thing about smoking. Its fucking awesome. I enjoy every cigarette I smoke, always have. Its a joy you will never know. And don't worry about the suicide part. I fully intend to kill myself before my smoking ever seriously affects my health. So fuck you. Idiot.
Steve, you seem to have as little control over your irrational view of smokers as we have over our nasty habit. Tell us how it feels to act on an impulse that you know is not healthy or sane. C'mon...let it out. You're among friends here. Frankly, you're exactly the kind of person that keeps me smoking. Your self righteous, rude and preachy (and probably screechy) attempt to tell everyone else how to live their lives goes against everything great about this country, and I will not let you succeed. I've never spent so much as an hour in a hospital, nor a penny of the health insurance companies' precious fortunes. I'm willing to bet that I outlive you, too. ::blowing smoke in Steve's face::
Silly steve duncan!
If Obama's problem is as Horwitz says, that "He can seem aloof, over-groomed and fussy about eating the right foods and getting enough exercise" he doesn't have to go back to the coffin nails, he just has to publicize his love for greasing down at the Valois (vuh-loyz) Cafeteria. A breakfast from there will hasten your demise about as quickly as a pack of Winstons and tastes a whole lot better.
Obesity has recently overtaken smoking as the biggest health risk to Americans. Maybe Obama should pork up.
More humorous than steve duncan's posts are the inevitable, "I'm 22, I smoke a pack a day, don't exercise all that much, and I'm perfectly healthy and not even so much as a bit overweight! I will be able to maintain this routine forever!"
Your ..........attempt to tell everyone else how to live their lives goes against everything great about this country. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Yeah, Steve, and that really sucks. I should be able to give an abortion to my sister with cyanide tucked in my pee-hole while having intercourse with her. As long as we're both down, of course. Not surprised that you're against that type of freedom.
Addiction is such a piss poor excuse for continuing to smoke it barely rises to meriting refutation. However, here goes: Just fucking quit. Steve, if you had some weird medical condition where you could significantly lower your risk of cancer by never having an orgasm ever again, would you find it easy to quit all sexual activity? And let's throw in the idea that doctors recommend you give up normal human food and just eat some bland nutrient gruel for the rest of your life too. I don't really think giving up smoking would be as hard as giving up orgasms or good-tasting food (though I've never been a smoker), but it's foolish to imagine giving up an addiction is just an easy matter of summoning up a little willpower.
Is it really that easy to troll this site and derail a comment thread? In that case:
Smoking while bad for the body is good for the Soul. It relaxes prison inmates, calms mental patients and is often a nice, small, post-coital pleasure. Not a big smoker (a pack a week at most) but the yuppie totalitarian impulse to ban smoking illustrates their soulless master plan. Recall the great playwright Bertolt Brecht contrasting his interrogation by the Gestapo to his later grilling by the FBI in McCarthyite America: "At least the Nazis let me smoke." Yes, at least they had the decency to honor Old World courtesies.
I don't really think giving up smoking would be as hard as giving up orgasms or good-tasting food (though I've never been a smoker), but it's foolish to imagine giving up an addiction is just an easy matter of summoning up a little willpower.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Smoking is a lower class thing? I have had two "real" jobs since college and at both of them most of the upper management smoked. It seemed like the best way to move-up at my first company was to get to know the directors in te smoking area.
Steve,
I had suggested to a friend before the West Virginia primary that Obama go down there and not only smoke openly but hand out packs of cigarettes to the masses. Definitely would have cut into that 40 point margin. Alas, smoking is such a taboo in the world of upper middle class professionals that it probably would have dealt a death blow to hs candidacy.
OK Jesse, to extend your premise a bit, if someone told you unless you quit smoking they were going to bury you alive could you quit? You didn't answer my question, you just responded with another question. Please address whether *you* would find it easy to give up orgasms or eating anything other than nutrient gruel if you were told that your risk of cancer over the next several decades would significantly increase if you didn't. If you ignore this question, that'll tend to confirm that you're just trolling rather than making a sincere, thoughtful argument. I can't really address your scenario because I'm not a regular smoker (I've had maybe 3 in my entire life), so "quitting" doesn't seem like a challenge. But if you actually extended my premise and asked if I would give up orgasms or tasty food to avoid being buried alive, then sure, I would even give up more basic things like the use of my limbs--there isn't much worse than being buried alive! On the other hand, would I give up orgasms or tasty food if the failure to do so would mean I would have around a 1 in 6 chance of developing cancer at some point in life, as this wikipedia article says is true for smokers? I'd probably be willing to take that gamble given the massive reduction in quality of life from giving up orgasms or tasty food, and given the odds are good there'll be better treatments (or even a cure) for cancer in the next few decades. I'm not saying giving up smoking would lead to the same reduction in quality of life as giving up basic biological urges like orgasms or good-tasting food (I think most addicts find giving up smoking hardest initially, but if they can go without for a few weeks or months it's not so difficult any more), just that it's easy for us nonsmokers to fail to empathize with the difficulty of giving it up, so replacing smoking with something like orgasms/food makes it easier to understand. Of course, responding to people you think are making really stupid choices with empathy rather than anger is a choice--and self-righteous anger seems to have the qualities of an addiction too, as suggested by David Brin in this article: I want to zoom down to a particular emotional and psychological pathology. The phenomenon known as self-righteous indignation.
Steve Duncan, how about instead of putting the gun in my mouth I put it in yours you brain dead pile of shit? I can't wait until you're dead.
Peter K., I've smoked maybe a dozen times in my life, and at least in the short term, it's always relieved my asthma symptoms. I assume it's because of the stimulant effect of the nicotine. P.S.: Confidential to WillieStyle -- Yo momma!
I was at the US Open on Saturday and was standing in line to get in to the stands at the 18th hole. Guy behind me takes a huge drag on his death stick (smoking was banned, of course, not least because of all the dry grass on the non-golfing areas) and it blows right in my face as I turn around to look at something. Me: Thank you *so much* for that. Fucking smokers.
Are you sure they were laughing WITH you, Henry?
Yeah, hey smokers, just speaking as another non-smoker here, lemme just say that Steve Duncan does NOT speak for me. I've never smoked in my life, and smoking-related lung cancer killed two of my grandparents, and yeah, I think it's a revolting habit. All the same, how about reacting with empathy rather than furious rage when you see someone with an addiction?
"...how about reacting with empathy rather than furious rage when you see someone with an addiction?" Posted by Adam Villani | June 17, 2008 9:02 PM
I don't want your empathy, duncan. I'll keep smoking, and every cigarette will be that much sweeter knowing how it makes you feel. I only smoking about half a pack a week, but maybe I'll fit a few more in just for you.
Two packs a day, too many steves, why half-ass it? Throw in some meth while you're at it, I find abuse of that pretty aggravating also.
The late great BH: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z9O1Cv7wudU http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EDGi9wi4kkM
Sure there's nothing you're addicted to, Steve? Being a sententious dickhead, for example?
Ever noticed all the smokers outside Alcoholics Anonymous meetings? Tobacco addiction will likely you in the end, but it's a lot better for you and everyone around you in the meantime than is alcoholism. Obama's relatives include many alcoholics. His father killed a man while drunk driving, then got himself killed in another drunk driving crash. His half-brother David died in a motorcycle crash after a night of drinking. His half-brother Abongo converted to fundamentalist Islam to get over his alcoholism. His maternal grandfather appears to have been a borderline alcoholic. Obama, himself, appears to barely ever drink, which is wise considering the addictive personality genes he likely inherited. So, I would much prefer that a President Obama relieve stress by a smoke than by a drink.
Noting that smoking has become a rather class-bound phenomenon Didn't Matt Y smoke until a year ago or so, lol? Also keep in mind, that nobody ever beat his wife and children, raped a woman or got into a street fight because they smoked too many cigarettes.
Steve Duncan, you're an idiot. I've never been a smoker but if people are self-medicating in a way that doesn't hurt others, its heartless to condemn them. Smoking is nothing more or less than self-medication. Nicotine has the unusual property of being both a stimulant and an antidepressant, so you can treat your ADHD and your depression (or anxiety) at the same time. Nicotine has a very short half life (about an hour) and within a couple of days, its out of your system. A great deal of the "cravings" that ex-smokers feel for weeks or months after quitting is simply their now untreated medical condition. The only people who make sense about all this are Mormons. They don't drink, smoke or even drink coffee. They deal with their mental pain like the rest of us should, by making a doctor's appointment (Utah has a 60% higher rate of antidepressant prescriptions than the national average). For anyone trying to quit smoking, there is a prescription drug that, like nicotine, is both a stimulant and an antidepressant. Buproprion. Glaxo markets it for smoking cessation as Zyban (and charges much money, somebody's got to pay for the ad campaign). If you don't have health insurance, ask your doctor to write a script for generic Buproprion (Glaxo marketed it for years as Wellbutrin). And Steve Sailer is absolutely correct. Compared to alcohol and the impact drunk drivers have on the lives of others, nicotine is a very benign addiction.
Wow...I used to take Wellbutrin, briefly. In addition to the benefits beowulf mentions, it also markedly improves your golf game.
Peter K., I've smoked maybe a dozen times in my life, and at least in the short term, it's always relieved my asthma symptoms. I assume it's because of the stimulant effect of the nicotine. Yeah come to think of it, my symptoms were relieved after bong hits. I liked puffing on the breather, so cool...
Speaking of Jed Bartlett, is it a coincidence that Obama's campaign organization is named "Obama for America"?
Comments closed July 01, 2008. |
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Heads in the Sand
The hard slog of trying to quit is probably more endearing (...and healthful!) then just carrying on.
Posted by Ilya Gerner | June 17, 2008 3:35 PM