The competition in the Western Conference just gets tougher as Houston acquired Ron Artest in exchange for draft picks and Bobby Jackson. Good news for Houston. If only they could get some recycling bins.
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Artest to Houston
31 Jul 2008 11:29 am
Comments (28)
Now that would've been an awesome trade.
Houston is scary. Hollinger had an article yesterday where he pointed out that Houston was the only destination where Artest will help out more offensively than defensively. They already have a perimeter stopper in Battier, so Artest is going to have to guard the 4 often times. Thought that was a pretty interesting point. But its going to be very, very difficult to throw up more than 90 on Houston now.
Oh well. I guess I'll have to put up with at least two more years of the Kings sucking.
Hopefully they don't screw up with their picks next year.
If only they could get some recycling bins.
Why? If they just leave Scola on sidewalk, I'm sure someone will pick him up.
Yeah, Freddie, you could be right. But I thought they would go a smaller, and have Scola come off the bench. Battier at the 3, and Artest at the 4. That puts Artest out of position offensively, but that lineup is nasty.
Wow, I guess not opting out wasn't such a terrible idea.
"Hopefully, he's not fighting anymore and going after a guy in the stands..."
Yeah, Yao has the right to question Artest's sanity. But making this statement to the paper kind of comes off as a cheap shot to a new teammate. But maybe the language barrier got in the way a bit, and this is just Yao's way of saying, "I hope he's calmed down a bit." I actually thought Artest handled it pretty well. He made a point defer to Yao.
Yao expressed concerns about team chemistry to the Houston Chronicle and referenced Artest's involvement in the 2004 brawl with Pistons fans.
"Hopefully, he's not fighting anymore and going after a guy in the stands," Yao said, according to the Chronicle.
When asked about those comments, Artest said Yao had bought into "all the propaganda" about him, according to The Sacramento Bee.
"I understand what Yao said, but I'm still ghetto," Artest said, according to the report. "That's not going to change. I'm never going to change my culture. Yao has played with a lot of black players, but I don't think he's ever played with a black player that really represents his culture as much as I represent my culture."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Yes, of course it's understandable for a man making millions to want to obstinately remain part of the ghetto. There are thousands of young black men from the ghetto that complete college, becoming doctors, lawyers, titans of business, successful politicians and educators. Each eventually sees the value in remaining mired in the crime, squalor, hopelessness and decay they fought so hard to escape. Don't work to change the ghetto, be one with the ghetto. Gotta stay true to your culture. A little brawling, a little gun play, smack a couple whores around for holding out. All in a day's work for a rich, prominent, successful black man from the ghetto. Way to go, Ronny!
They still need to get rid of T-Mac if they want to get past the first round.
Clown,
T-Mac's playoff numbers are very good. I don't buy that at all.
Steve Duncan,
You're a nerd. Save it for the non-basketball threads.
The problem with playing Artest at the 4 is that he's not a very good rebounder. Neither is Battier. So a lineup with McGrady, Battier and Artest out there at once is unbelievable lockdown D and pretty weak rebounding.
Anyway, great trade for Houston, if Artest can hold it together for a year (one year is all you're ever going to get out of Artest before it blows up in your face). But what's with that comment about Yao not playing with black guys who are as black as Artest? I think if I were Rafer Alston I'd be a little insulted. The whole team isn't a bunch of Battiers.
When you can get a player like Artest, you make the trade and figure out how to work it out later. But what is the starting lineup?
This is the lineup w/o Artest: Yao/Scola/Battier/TMac/Alston
Now, Artest's natural position is the 2/3, so it would make the most sense to kick off Battier and go with: yao/scola/artest/tmac/alston. But Battier is a better player than both Scola and Alston. You could go small with Yao/Artest/Battier/TMac/Alston, but 82games.com indicates that Artest is worse as a PF, probably worse than Scola. So do you kick off Alston? Go TMac at the point? Maybe that's the best solution.
Dtah, that never even crossed my mind with the possibilty of T-Mac playing point. That would be ballsy. I'd love to see it. I still think you take your chances and play Artest at the 4. As TMS said, the rebounding would suffer a bit, but doesn't T-Mac rebound pretty well for a 2? Averages around 6.5 or something, right?
That's why I had Scola in my starting lineup, because I assumed that he was a good rebounder. Looking at these numbers though I think this simply isn't going to be a great rebounding team. I do think that Scola really outplayed Battier down the stretch last season, and I kind of like Battier coming off the bench. I really don't think that Artest can plausibly play the 2 now.
I don't like the trade, from Houston's stand point. Artest duplicates Battier - neither can play the 4 effectively, and Artest can't play the 2 with T-Mac there. Moreover, while Artest has more defensive talent, I'm not sure he's actually a better defender at this point, given his lack of consistency. Plus, Artest's offensive style is too much like T-Mac: low ball movement. I think they shuold have gone the other way - get a better shooter at the 3.
Yeah, Al, but they will clearly better in '08-'09 than they were before this trade, right? They had no other choice but to go for it, it seems. What shooter do you think they should have gone after?
I agree with everything Al said, and I still like the trade for Houston. If you can get Ron Artest and hardly give up anything, go for it. I think Battier will be fine coming off the bench, and I think they might have some success with small/weird lineups. Battier, Artest and McGrady can all play 2 or 3 positions. You don't want Artest or Battier as your starting 4 but either one can play there a little.
The big questions with Artest are intensity/effort and ball-hogging. The first shouldn't be a problem in a contract year, you would think. The ball-hogging could really much things up though.
Artest duplicates Battier
Artest is a much, much more physical player than Battier, and is 250. I don't think people are realizing how much bulk and strength this guy has gained in his NBA career. He routinely guards 4s who are 4 inches taller than him, and guards them well.
Doesn't a lot of this depend on whether they sign Carl Landry or not? If they don't, they'll be forced to play Artest at PF a bunch, it seems.
don't like the trade, from Houston's stand point. Artest duplicates Battier - neither can play the 4 effectively, and Artest can't play the 2 with T-Mac there.
No way. Houston already had two solid 4s, now they have two solid 3s. I don't want to go all Doc Rivers here, but these are the lineups I see:
Yao/Artest/Battier/TMac/Alston
Yao/Scola/Battier/TMac/Alston
Yao/Landry/Battier/TMac/Alston
Yao/Scola/Artest/TMac/Alston
Yao/Landry/Artest/TMac/Alston
Yao/Scola/Battier/Artest/Alston
Yao/Landry/Battier/Artest/Alston
Yao/Scola/Battier/Artest/TMac
Yao/Landry/Battier/Artest/TMac
Scola/Landry/Battier/Artest/TMac
Scola/Landry/Battier/Artest/Alston
That's some scary shit. Maybe not each one in particular, but to have that much flexibility, to shift small or big at a moment's notice, and be more or less impervious to foul trouble in the paint? If Adelman can manage the egos, and someone can snipe consistently from beyond the arc, I think the Rockets should be a force to be feared in the playoffs.
Doesn't a lot of this depend on whether they sign Carl Landry or not?
My bad, I wasn't aware his contract was up. Is he an RFA or UFA?
In more interesting news, Ken Griffey Jr was traded to the white sox...
I don't know if they are clearly better. I just don't see how you can play Battier or Artest at the 4 most nights - can either defend or be an effective rebounder against Amare, Duncan, Boozer, Gasol, Dirk, etc.?
But more important to me is on the offensive end. I think Houston's biggest problem is that too often they played 3-on-5. Dump it to Yao, if that doesn't work, send it back out to T-Mac or Rafer and let them go one-on-one. No ball movement. I don't know that Artest helps that (although, to my mind, the bigger problem is T-Mac).
In more interesting news, Ken Griffey Jr was traded to the white sox...
Artest can certainly guard 4s -- he can guard just about anybody. But I don't think you want to subject him to the beating of guarding 4s every night. And there's no way he can rebound adequately at the 4.
But Al, you're nuts about T-Mac being the problem on offense. Ball movement? The team's internal top-secret stats put T-Mac as the best passer in the league among wing guys. I'd probably agree, although LeBron's close.
Don't forget about the epic Brent Barry signing! Dude won the slam dunk contest in warmups back in 1981 or something!
Comments closed August 14, 2008.
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Heads in the Sand
Just what they need, if Artest can behave himself. Yao/Artest/Scola/T-Mac/Alston, with Battier as a sixth man and Hayes the first big man off the bench. That's a good team, and a potentially great defensive team. Artest down there takes so much defensive pressure off of Yao.
By the way, Yao has every right to question Artest's sanity. When you are a part of that brawl, in that way, you don't get to complain when people ask if you've got all your marbles.
Posted by Freddie | July 31, 2008 11:39 AM